Justin Turner: Another Human

Per a report on Twitter……Trevor Bauer is supposed to have a zoom meeting with the Dodgers tomorrow,,,what ever the hell that is,

Cubs cut the cord with Lester. But they are picking up Rizzo’s option. Red Sox are talking to Cora, so there could be a reunion there. Seems to me cheating, or at least condoning it is going to pay off for those two. Lot of new free agents as teams continue to clean house.

He ran out of gas? 50 some games, 200 or so plate appearances and he ran out of gas? That’s not a good sign.

Lux did appear disengaged, that’s true. He might have had a lot on his mind. In a year like this one I’m willing to put it in the rear view and go forward.

Everyone is going to want more money. That’s always going to be true. The market will level itself. One way or another, it always does.

Bullpen Mark? I think a year of Hand for 10mil is a good deal. And let’s hope that Lux surprises us like Smith did this year. That would save a lot of capital for other areas. That’s been a key in the AF era. A lot of young talent balancing out the high end stars salaries

I think the Dodgers will make a couple of moves by the weekend.

Do the Dodgers hope that Price opts out in 21? And sign a couple of high end relievers like Hand and a righty? I would think a lot of guys are going to sign 1 year deals in hopes that 22 will be better financially

Regarding the JT storyline… you always have to ask yourself a few things when any news reports come in.

~ What questions are being asked and just as important, what questions are Not being asked?

~ Who is leaking / feeding information to reporters and who benefits from this information being leaked?

~ Does it feel like one particular narrative is being pushed and framed in a certain way… while other narratives are being suppressed or hidden?

~ And if this is the case, then who benefits from that information being suppressed and framed in that particular way?

~ Who has the power and influence to push and frame certain narratives and storylines while suppressing other important information?

~ Are the reporters and news organizations that are reporting on this story hyper focusing on one particular storyline or are they being good, fair, and honest journalists by looking at all angles of the story and trying to get to the truth of the matter?

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Rob Manfred and MLB knew that they screwed up badly and needed to use all their resources (newspapers, journalists, mlb network, etc) to take the focus off their incompetence and ineptitude and move that focus over to something / someone else. JT did make it a little easier on them by coming back onto the field… but the fact that this narrative was pushed so hard and so quickly on Tuesday night, without talking to everyone involved on the Dodgers (and everyone in their bubble) and not putting the spotlight or at least equal time to questioning MLB, Rob Manfred, and the Sports Medicine Research and Testing Lab that was in charge of testing the players… really tells you everything you need to know.

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The main headline on Tuesday night should have been, the Dodgers win the world series after a 32 year drought, Kershaw’s redemption, etc. The next biggest headline (if there were any journalistic principles left) would be to focus on the incompetence and malpractice of Rob Manfred and MLB for allowing two baseball teams to even start game 6 without the test results from the previous day!!! How is this not a bigger story!!??

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How are we getting test results from MONDAY (A day off by the way) after Tuesday’s game starts??? How and why would a game as important as this be allowed to start without knowing these test results before the first pitch is thrown. And how can they magically rush the new results so quickly for Tuesday’s tests after finding a positive result from Monday’s batch. Wouldn’t you think the lab along with MLB would have / should have put a rush on getting Monday’s test results before game 6 started???

Here is one for you that is closer to home. Who do they need to put on the roster and protect in the rule 5 draft? The Dodger site said deGeus, Carillo and Jackson are the most likely with Kendall, Kasowski, Reks, and Estevez on the bubble. I think they non tender Alexander, Floro might get an offer. None of them gets the QO.

Per Jon Heyman

“Not one team claimed Brad Hand for $10M. He was a top 3 finalist for AL reliever of the year with a 0.77 WHIP. and 16 saves. Time to revise free agent contract projections downward! (Hand is now a free agent after Indians then declined the $10M option and paid $1M buyout.)“

In a perfect world, Lindor would be my SS, but there is no way I would pay what the Indians would want for him. Maybe as a Free Agent in 2022, but I think I would still take Seager.

When was the last time the team with the best Shortstop in baseball won the World Series?

Baseball-Reference 162 Game Average for both players:

Lindor: .285 BA/.346 OB%/.488 SLG/.833 OPS/OPS+ 117/40 DBL/3TPL/106 Runs/86 RBI

Seager: .295 BA/.362 OB%/.500 SLG/.863 OPS/OPS+ 129/43 DBL/3 TPL.102 Runs/92 RBI

Lindor is a better defender. Lindor steals 21 bases a year (which will decline) Seager steals 3.

I am going to keep dancing with the guy who was the World Series MVP… even if he is not “THE BEST” SS in baseball!

Here is what baffles me: At our company, we buy 25 RAPID COVID-19 tests for $450.00. https://medisonictech.com/

It is a blood test that pricks your finger and the results are available in 15 minutes. They are about 97% accurate and if you get a positive, you do two more tests. It’s a lot cheaper than sending an employee to get tested and having them sit at home until they get the test back – typically 36 to 48 hours.

Why is it that a company with 54 employees can do this and MLB cannot?

Manfred is a moron.

Here’s a photo of Manfred and Torre together:

I wonder if all the players that opted out of this season will opt out again for next season, because in reality the circumstances are going to be very similar early next year, when ST starts?

What fine do you get for turning up drunk to award the World Series Trophy?

Badger

* I to value strength up the middle and shortstop is the most important athletic position on the field. I love Lindor. He’s a special talent and seems like a team guy. I’ve watched him a ton at Spring Training and he makes “Ozzie-like” defensive plays and he switch hits. I see your interest in him becoming a Dodger.

* But a couple of things convoluted the deal. One is the obvious expense. He will be expensive at a time when many of our stars need to be signed and stay with the club in a volatile financial situation,

* Number 2 is what do you do with Seager? I suggested before that AK and Doc have a nice long chat with Seager soon and see how badly he wants to stay at short. Would he consider a move? If not, he stays at short and we move on with Rios at 3rd or explore a right handed power bat. I think Seager deserves that consideration. While he may not have the range and flash of Lindor, he makes all the routine plays smoothly and is a force offensively. It’s his position if he wants to stay there.

* If Cory is receptive to moving to 3rd (my pick over 1st where he’s wasted) than AF actively pursues Lindor or Semien. (I think Lindor, Tim Anderson and Marcus Semien are the 3 best in the game.)

* Is moving Seager and obtaining Lindor going to make us that much better than pursuing other needs like a power right hand bat, preferably at a corner?

* I would package up Lux, maybe K-Bear and other non pitching prospects except McKinstry and see what it would take. Lindor might be priced out but who knows. We thought Mookie was out of reach.

* If you want to spend the kind of $ necessary to acquire Lindor, why not keep Seager at short and pursue spending the $ on LeMahieu which solves the revolving door at 2nd?

BulldogsandPenguins – I agree that MLB handled JT’s game 6 deal badly. What’s new. Did I miss the news that JT’s test was indeed positive and others were infected? Are results in on others who were tested? He definitely violated protocol as he was advised at the time he was positive but did I miss “the rest of the story?”

Voting is now open for the all-MLB team – had to leave some positions blank but I was able to vote for Ryu and Maeda

https://www.mlb.com/fans/all-mlb-team

Rays cut both Zunino and Morton loose. MLB is considering a tiered spring with AAA and MLB players reporting first, and the lower levels at a later date. A lot of players have not had their options picked up. All these trade scenario’s and what will the team do make little sense 3 days after the series ends. But even the networks and pundits are throwing thier 2 cents in on who is going to win next year. Hell, let me enjoy this one first.

Leave it for some controversy to take some of the joy out of what they accomplished. He violated protocol. He will probably get fined. There is no need for MLB to INVESTIGATE anything. JT and his wife are still in Texas, the team is home. What if his test turns out to be a false positive and all his subsequent tests are negative? I also think that pulling him from the game in the 8th inning, and then isolating him when he has been around all of those guys for the entire time in the bubble is like closing the barn door after the livestock have run away. Makes little sense. Friedman defended him, and I admire him for protecting his player. I also think in the heat of the moment JT made a decision. In afterthought it was probably the wrong one. But I am not going to crucify the guy for wanting to share what probably is a once in a lifetime moment for him with his team mates. Now we sit back and see if anyone gets sick because of what happened. Where I live, things are much different than in major population centers. People here are wearing masks when they are in a public place, but pretty much no where else. I just wish for everyone to stay healthy. On top of all that stuff, Belli had an interview with Jimmy Kimmel on the telephone while he was driving home. Kimmel asked him if he was high because he looked like he was. Belli’s answer was rather cryptic, and it kind of surprised a lot of people. He said I am not high, that’s just how my face looks.

I think Turner should have been permitted to come onto the field as long as he wore a mask and had sanitized after being pulled out of the game. He should have stayed out of the scrum and let players come to him as they chose to do. He should have seated himself on the end of the group for the team picture and kept his mask on and then immediately moved away from the group.

Not to make light of Turner’s infraction but I would let the penalty be shaving his beard and trimming his hair and offering a home team discount.

Steve Cohen has been approved as new owner of the Mets.

Why should we care? Because he’s got lots and lots of money and is a huge baseball fan. I’m sure his first priority will be to put a winning product back on the field and not worry about profits.

Where we used to be concerned about competition from the Yanks on free agents, we’ll now have to add the Mets to that list. I imagine the Mets will be very active this winter.

If anybody should be investigated it should be mlb. The testing should have been completed prior to the game. Thanks to mlb incompetence he was out there for 7 innings. That should be the story. If mlb was so worried about it they should have gotten it right before the game. If we are really worried about safety mlb should have been all over this. Turner had to be thinking mlb put me in thi.s position and now they want to make me the story. Man Fred was embarrassing during the telecast and should take responsibility. If the reports are correct let’s fine mlb.

It’s a non story. Turner did what most anybody would have done. It is such hypocrisy to judge him. The talk should be about a great Dodger team and organization. Let mlb do what they will and you know it will be wrong.

Really enjoyed reading your comments, William, and agree with them. Thank you for your intelligent thoughts.

Detroit signs AJ Hinch to be their manager. Multi-year contract.

In Los Angeles, as everywhere, it is so important to emphasize the need for people to wear masks. I see many people not doing that, even when there are signs in various places mandating it. I see people wearing it around their neck, sort of like keeping a pass in your pocket to pull out any time someone might stop you. The masks are supposed to be worn, not as some sort of badge that gets you through.

It has been estimated that if 95% of the people wore masks for a few months, the virus might disappear. But too many people seem to think that “freedom” means that you get to do anything you want. Do you get to drive 95 mph through city streets, just because you feel like it? Do you get to go inside a restaurant and eat in the nude? Do you get to play your saxophone outside on the street at 4am because it makes you feel good? Of course not. The state, the city, has the right to mandate or ban certain actions for the public health and safety. Can we argue about them? Of course. But if people go around acting as if the state has no right to set health or safety policy, and everyone can just do what they want, they are risking everybody’s health, as we see on a daily basis, with these superspreader events, which have been documented to have spiked the virus when they occur. They have basically gotten rid of the virus in Australia and New Zealand which can be attributed to a larger space with less overall density, and a populace which listens to health authorities,and follows their protocols. Here, we have 1,000 people and now more, dying every day from it, with no end in sight, and maybe worse things ahead. How depressing and infuriating.

With that background in mind, I cannot just excuse Turner’s actions. I will say, as others have done, that he had been around those players for two weeks, and it is highly unlikely that five or ten minutes of standing around them, wearing a mask, would have been any greater of a risk. And I understand his wish to celebrate something he had been striving for, for many years. And it also comes amid the daily scenes of thousands of people going to various events conspicuously not wearing masks, as if it is a battle between the mask-wearers and the non-mask-wearers, to score points. Most media just lets this go, or shrugs and says, “well, there are two sides.” And for them now to be outraged at Turner, looks pretty ridiculous. Ken Rosenthal apparently thinks this is the only story of the World Series, obviating everything else, as if Turner has risked so many people, as opposed to the guy walking down a crowded street, talking loudly on his cell phone, oblivious to everybody else, and their rights to be protected. I see people like this every day, they are like a gauntlet that one has to get through just to do errands or take a walk.

So what does this all amount to? Turner deserves criticism. But he is hardly a dreadful person who acted in a way that millions of other Americans are not acting. That fact actually does make it more important to condemn it, because the alternative message, that it is no big deal, is very dangerous. But what he did probably did not seriously risk anyone’s health, in that situation, with him wearing a mask. It is a shame that this story is obscuring the World Series on the field, the Dodgers’ championship. If those people who keep writing about it, would devote a tenth as much time to the problem of millions of people not wearing masks at all, we would be much better off.

Re: Lindor:

1 – Fernando Tatis Jr. lead all MLB SS in outs above average and runs prevented in 2020. In 2019, Javier Baez lead and Andrelton Simmons (also a free agent) was 2nd – Lindor was 6th. In 2018, Nick Ahmed was far and away the best defensive SS in MLB. Chris Taylor was 9th in 2018, Seager 13th in 2019 and 22nd in 2020. Lindor is a good defensive SS but generally Simmons has been considered the best defensive SS in baseball for quite a while and Ahmed is close behind.

2 – Seager is generally competent at SS and makes all of the plays. And he can really hit if he’s healthy.

3 – Lindor will cost an arm and a leg to pry loose from the Indians and then will demand $30MM/year as a free agent in 2022. I doubt that he is worth the cost to the Dodgers in prospects or to sign to an extension.

4 – The Dodgers are going to have to shell out big to their own free agents in a few years. Kershaw is a free agent after 2021 and he’s not going anywhere but LA. Seager is a free agent in 2022, Bellinger and Urias in 2024 and Buehler in 2025. If they spend too much on other free agents they won’t be able to resign their own.

Off season priorities

1. Resign JT

2. Extend Seager

3. Take a flier on a couple relievers

4. Comb through possible trades/free agents. See what’s available and would it be a significant upgrade? There will be lots of bargains this off season.

Re: #4. We are the best team in baseball. There aren’t a lot of places for significant upgrades. But this off-season is uncharted territory.

As I see it, position question marks are LF/3B/2B. I think we have 3B solutions if we resign JT. A 3rd or 4th outfielder (depending how you rate Pollock) to replace Joc if the price is right. We are thin in OF prospects. 2B is still a question until Lux proves he is the answer.

“People aren’t chess pieces.“

Sure they are. At one time or another most of us have been moved in ways for which we didn’t ask.

And likely Seager won’t want to move. ARod didn’t want to move and he did. Ask him about it now and I’m sure he would say “whatever makes the team better”. That of course is the right answer and Lindor obviously makes the team better. That said, I doubt it happens.

We still don’t get the “tested positive” implications. Once that happens the game changes.

I think this is stupid. Justin Turner was with the team all day and 7 innings into the game. He could of effected everyone by then. If I was his teammate, I would of personally gone to the office and brought him out. Put the mask on and social distance and celebrate with us. He deserved it. This is more BS then I care to comment on. What about all the other MLB players that broke protocol this season. Did anything happen to them? Manfred is an idiot. Now I said what I think.

I honestly didn’t think it was that big of a deal. He played seven innings, was in the clubhouse and in the dugout before and during the game. I don’t think he should have hugged anyone and with the exception of taking pictures should have kept the mask on. But the entire team was exposed earlier. I believe Dave Roberts because of his prior health issues should have distanced himself a little more.

I’m guessing MLB will impose some type of penalty, but their goal was to get in a season and they did that. Once the season ends so does the protocols. Was it bad judgement, probably, but we’ll see if anybody else gets infected. But as I recall Manfred didn’t have his mask on during the ceremonies. Speaking, I get removing the mask, but he never put it back on. Dodger management did wear masks during the ceremonies.

So what should the Dodgers do moving forward. I would re-sign Turner to a short term deal. What about the trade for Lindor, move Cory Seager to third murmurs that persist even though Seager was the MVP of both the NL championship series and the World Series.

Did anybody actually consider that Seager may want to remain at shortstop. Why would he want to move? He probably wants to stay with the Dodgers — as a shortstop. There is a human element to all this. People aren’t chess pieces.

But we should also look at the financial side. It has been reported that baseball will lose three billion in 2020, not hard to believe since there were no fans. Stan Kasten said the Dodgers will lose $100 million in revenue this year and it will take years to recover.

It could be a bleak winter for free agents. The Dodgers need to sign Seager long term, Cody Bellinger and Walker Buehler too. Unless they’ve got a money printing press in the stadium, it’s difficult to see how they could do all that and afford Lindor long term. This is already an incredible team and everybody seems to agree they are built well for the future. Not to mention the massive contract they’ve already given Mookie Betts.

Will fans be back in the stands come spring. I would hope so. A new Orange County study by UC Irvine and OC public health found that the county’s infection rate was eight times higher than what is being reported. It is also far less deadly than was originally reported last spring. If you can pack mask people in an airplane, why can’t they attend a game outdoors?

With the vaccine and all the new treatments they have, time to move forward, not backward in dealing with this issue.

The Dodgers have depth, quality players throughout the line-up, excellent bench, bullpen, up and coming young players, the starters, with the exception of Turner, are all under 30. They have young starting pitching. Several baseball pundits, including Jayson Stark, have said the Dodgers may have the best minor league system in the game.

Smart leadership is the icing on the cake.

One more thought, we should give some credit to Ned Colletti, who had a hand in creating this championship team.

Darn shame we didn,t trade Lux for Mookie instead of Verdugo.

B&P,

Regarding JT and MLB,

Here here.

I think the most egregious part of the Turner incident is the fact that he was pulled in the 7th inning of a deciding WS game! How the hell does this happen? How does this make any sense whatsoever? What about the integrity of the game? This could have had a really bad look with an error at 3B leading to an upset win by the Rays. What a total failure. You mean to tell me that they didn’t make sure testing was in place to have everyone take tests at the hotel with results in before they reached the stadium? And then to make a big fuss when he joined his teammates on the field for the celebration AFTER THE SEASON WAS OVER!!!??? What a joke that everyone is talking about JT’s irresponsible behavior and not talking about MLB’s irresponsible behavior. Then they’ll have another phony “investigation” like the one where Joe Kelly got a 8 game suspension for being wild and not hitting someone. Hell, he could have gotten a suspension every time he pitched this year following that logic. Or, the “investigation” that yielded a month for Julio’s girlfriend tripping over herself when the police didn’t even charge him. Or, the “investigation” that yielded no suspensions for the Astros cheating their way to a World Series title? What a joke!

Move on from JT. Any player that wasn’t comfortable being near JT had the personal choice to walk away from him. The season was over, there were no games in jeopardy.

Trade for Merrifield and sign Bauer! There’s so many relievers available. Hendricks, Colome, Rosenthol, Hand. Grab a couple and go for the repeat, with of course, bringing back JT on a two year, team friendly deal.

I was looking at the list of Free Agents and hadn’t realised that JDL was available.

What do you think AC, has that ship sailed?

There’s some interesting names on there.

I would say ,yes he violated a MLB rule, but I wouldn’t say he was wrong. Do the crime and pay the time but hug your teammates and be in the picture! I’ll bet not one person gets ill from what he did, we’ll see. He was only with people he had already been around, and it was a super special moment.

I’m sure he would do the same thing today.

I agree with you entirely, Mark. Who among us hasn’t made mistakes, including ones that may have (inadvertently) put other people at risk? We have some neighbors whom we invited over recently to celebrate our daughter’s birthday. We kept social distance in our livingroom, but didn’t wear masks. The next day, we learned that the husband hadn’t been feeling well for a couple of days, but they didn’t tell us. Then the day after the visit, he tested positive for Covid. Who was at fault? Yes, he should have told us he wasn’t feeling well. Yes, we should have worn masks. We let our guard down in a situation where we were celebrating. Fortunately, we didn’t develop symptoms, but just in case, we self-quarantined for 10 days. Moral of the story: We are human. We make mistakes.

I have always respected Justin for his leadership, talent, turning around his career, and work in the community. When you are a public figure, you have special responsibity, and are open to scrutiny. He should be punished. And he should say and do some things to try to undo any harm he has done. A simple admission that he was wrong is a good place to start. Not a Houston Astericks apology, but a genuine one.

I still have a lot of respect for Justin, and want him back on the team. Making a mistake is human, how you handle it shows your character. Let’s give him the chance to show his character.

OK, so what discipline should be meted out to all of the MLB players who broke protocol, infected other teammates, coaches, etc. resulting in illnesses, postponed or canceled games? By no means am I trying to defend Turner’s selfish actions, but I believe MLB has set a precedent by not taking any (reported) discipline against players who put a lot more people at risk than did Turner.

Hard for me to listen to Stephen A.. I respect his point of view, I just don’t like being yelled at.

You are right Mark, what Turner did was wrong. They all agreed to protocols set forth and Turner violated them. There will be punishment, but if baseball follows its own stare decicis it will be a slap on the wrist.

When do you think this country will begin to take this crisis seriously?

In response to Bums post on the previous thread regarding what every team should do to improve:

“The Dodgers make their second huge trade of 2020 and acquire Francisco Lindor, shifting Corey Seager to third base.“

What a great idea.

Where have I heard that before?