Ryu gets tattooed and now there is a problem with the starting pitching? I do not consider Ryu anything more than a #7 on this team. I have no idea whether Ryu would have pitched better with regular rest or extended. Maybe his curve just does not work in Colorado. I have no delusions that Ryu will be anywhere close to the pitcher he was before his shoulder problems.
We are not even 25% through the season and some are worrying who the #2 will be in the post-season. I think I will be comfortable with Kershaw/Hill/Urias/Maeda/McCarthy. If Wood continues to do well as a starter then someone else goes to the pen. Where does Brock Stewart figure into any of the discussions? I believe that the five identified was the rotation that management (field and FO) pictured before going to ST. I would agree that the Kershaw/Hill/Urias works only if Hill is able to pitch. Last reports was that the blister was not a problem and he is expected to rejoin the rotation soon. Is it a coincidence that Maeda and Hill pitched on the same day, and that Maeda then went on the DL? Is it possible that Hill takes Maeda’s spot and pitches Monday or Tuesday in SF? It was just verified tonight that both Hill and McCarthy will pitch in SF, along with Kershaw.
Dave Roberts has since attempted to explain the situation. Here’s his best effort, courtesy of MLB.com:
“Actually there was a hamstring incident a few weeks ago,” manager Dave Roberts said. “We talked about putting him on the disabled list a few weeks ago, but he assured us that he could continue to make starts, which he did, and pitched well.
“We made that decision last night after we saw [Rich Hill’s rehab] outing. We’ve talked about our starting pitching depth for a long time, to act on it, to be prudent, and that’s kind of what made that ultimate decision.”
If Hill comes down with another blister next time out, or needs to go back on the DL with the same problem before trade deadline, then maybe some discussions will be made to find another #2. But who is available better than Urias or Wood or even Maeda/McCarthy? Does anyone really believe that the Rays are going to trade Archer for SVS/Kike’/Willie Calhoun/Andy Sopko/Edwin Rios/Kyle Garlick. Start with Buehler and Alveraz and go from there. Same with Jose Quintana. Maybe rentals like Yu Darvish, or Jeremy Hellickson, or Marco Estrada will come available. They will not be cheap either.
Are the Dodgers the only NL team with starting pitching concerns? The Nationals have had 8 SP. They cannot find a #5. Scherzer and Strasburg form a very good #1 and #2, but they are the same #1 and #2 the Dodgers beat last year. With Gio Gonzalez and Tanner Roark, the Nats have a solid and formidable rotation. The same people who want to criticize the Dodgers for their oft injured SP, give the Nats a pass with Strasburg. The Cubs have had 5 SP but will need a 6th now that Anderson is on the DL. But let’s compare them to Alex Wood who some have labeled not very good and certainly not top tier:
John Lackey 42.0 IP, 4.29 ERA, 11 BB, 46 K, 4.18 K/BB, 8 HR (1.7 HR/9)
Jon Lester 41.1 IP, 3.27 ERA, 16 BB, 40 K, 2.50 K/BB, 4 HR (0.9 HR/9)
Kyle Hendricks 39.2 IP, 3.40 ERA, 16 BB, 34 K, 2.13 K/BB, 5 HR (1.1 HR/9)
Jake Arrieta 38.2 IP, 5.35 ERA, 12 BB, 44 K, 3.67 K/BB, 6 HR (1.4 HR/9)
.Alex Wood 29.2 IP, 2.73 ERA, 10 BB, 38 K, 3.80 K/BB, 1 HR (0.3 HR/9)
So it would appear that other than innings pitched, Alex Wood is at least at the same level as the Cubs starters, and better in many ways. He has a better ERA, better HR/9, better K/9, and 2nd best K/BB ratio. Of the Cubs starters, none have pitched into the 8th inning. Lester into the 7th twice, Lackey Hendricks, and Arrieta only once. Is there something wrong with Arrieta? If he was a Dodger that would certainly be a topic of discussion.
I do not know if anyone has seen film on Wood when he was with the Braves, but he and others have said that his arm levels were higher and more consistent in 2014. It was only when he injured his foot in 2015 that his arm lowered and he developed the inconsistency. Dodgerrick would know far better than me if the foot injury had anything to do with his dropping of his arm, but he has said that it did. Wood has worked with Rick Honeycutt in the past two off-seasons to bring his arm back up to where he was when he was with Atlanta. The baseball people agree with him that his arm is up higher now as it was with Atlanta, and he is a different pitcher.
Before Friday’s game, Dodger starting pitchers have pitched 197.0 innings, good for 6th in NL and 11th in ML. The Cubs are 20th with 183.2 and the Mets and all of their wunderkids are 24th with 180.1. The Giants are #1 with 213.2 IP, but are 27th in ERA with 4.93. How’s those additional SP innings working for them? Sure the Dodgers pitching has question marks. But so do the other teams. The Cards starters are looking very good, but will Leake and Lynn continue to pitch to the level they are at? Will Wacha break down again? Will any of the Mets DL pitchers come back and be effective? Will Harvey become a prominent pitcher again? Will Strasburg stay healthy all year? Will Arrieta return to CY form? Before we write off Hill, can we at least get to July?
The last time I checked the team that scores the most runs at the end of a game is declared the winner. One of the ways to help with having more runs at the end of the game is to make sure that the other team does not score many. The Dodgers do that better than any team in the NL. Would I prefer a steady rotation of five? Yes, but as long as they are winning, I can accept the ins and outs from the DL.
Minor League Update:
OKC was 5-2 winners over the Fresno Grizzlies (Astros) – Another fine start for Justin Masterson. 7 IP (98 pitches) 3 hits, 2 runs, 2 walks, and 6 strike outs. His ERA is down to 1.91. Madison Younginer pitched a perfect 8th and 9th for his 2nd save. Max Muncy and Darnell Sweeney each had a pair of hits, while Alex Verdugo had a 2 RBI night.
Tulsa beats Northwest Arkansas Naturals (KC) 9-4 – Tonight was Walker Buehler’s AA debut. It wasn’t stellar but he did not embarrass himself. 4 IP (53 pitches), 6 hits, 2 runs, 1 walk, and 3 strikeouts. Corey Copping pitched 2.1 in relief allowing 2 hits, no runs, with one strikeout to get his third win. Yaisel Sierra pitched the 9th inning to close out the win. Kyle Farmer (playing 3B tonight) and Jacob Scavuzzo each had three hits. Farmer is now back over .300 on the year. Tim Locastro and Edwin Rios added a pair of hits apiece. Johan Mieses added his 3rd HR of the year, and 2nd in two days.
Great Lakes lost to the Clinton Lumberjacks (Seattle) 8-3 – A.J. Alexy had a rough outing going 2.2 innings allowing 3 hits, 5 runs, 3 walks, and 2 strikeouts. He threw 61 pitches with 29 being strikes. Chris Mathewson (3 IP) and Andre Scrubb making his GL debut (2 IP) pitched 5 solid innings in relief. Combined no hits, no runs, 1 walk and 4 strikeouts. Offensively, Keibert Ruiz continued his hot streak with 2 more hits, bringing his average up to .293.
RC Quakes lost to the Visalia Rawhide (DBacks) – Dennis Santana had a very rough outing. He went 4.1 innings allowing only two hits, but gave up 6 runs (4 earned) with 3 walks, 3 HBP, and 3 strikeouts. Spitzbarth had another perfect inning with 3 strikeouts. Drew Jackson had a two hit night. Will Smith got another hit and RBI, but also had 2 errors at 3B tonight.
Earlier in the week I indicated that OKC had 3 OF and 15 pitchers, and surmised that there would be some movement. I thought Kyle Garlick would get a chance at OKC and Luke Raley would get the bump to Tulsa. Instead OF Logan Landon was assigned to OKC directly from Rancho. Recently signed pitcher Logan Darnell was assigned to Extended Spring Training.
Discussion (48)
Disagree, not disagreeable
Where is Amani Abdullah? He is not listed in top 30 prospects? It looks like Alvarez has taken a step back for some reason.
Wood in an understatement has been fantastic this year. He also exercised his demons in Colorado as he had not fared well there. With kershaw, wood, hill, Urias the dodgers have a solid 4 when healthy. This is something we have not had in the past 5 years. Long way to go we have to make the playoffs and we got to be healthy. If one of those falter McCarthy could be next. I also think if kazmir can get healthy he is a quality starter. Yes kazmir when right he is quality. Now we should be looking to improve our offense because in the big picture if healthy we have the horses in the starting rotation.
Ok, probably the last post of the night, but here goes. First of all , Woods is just a frigging beast right now. And Turner is totally under appreciated defensively , the guy can flat out pick it! All you need to know about how the Rockshow is feeling this weekend in a nutshell is to watch Nolan Arenado’s reaction to Turner’s stab to rob him of a sure hit and RBI. The Rockies know the approaching Death Star of Dodger Blue is coming, and they can’t do a damn thing about it. Our depth on both the position players, the starters, and the bullpen is going to grind these guys into dust. You can already see it, and all of us know that we are far from full strength right now. I think one of the keys over the last 3 or 4 games is the Team Dad, that’s right , Utley getting hot. It kind of solidified everybody else and got the hitting parade started. The pitching right now outside of Ryu, who I think will be much better next time around, is off the hook. Split or no split, we are right where we want to be right now, with a butt load of back up in Triple A. Starting to think this is the year. All the FAZ haters might need some ketchup to eat a big time amount of crow.
Another good start by Wood. We really have three good starters. They are Kershaw, Urias, and Wood. That leaves two spots for the other four. If they cannot do it, we have options in the minors. I am not worried about our starters.
Another good win for the Dodgers. A shut out in Colorado. One more tomorrow and we will be in first place.
I find the Panglossian rose-colored glasses through which the Dodgers’ starting pitching are viewed here somewhat ironic in light of yesterday’s post by the host here:
” What we do know is this:
Brandon McCarthy is being built up gradually after his TJ Surgery;
Ryu is also being built up slowly after missing two years;
Scott Kazmir is out for the foreseeable future;
Julio Urias is having his innings limited to 180 or less, so he started late;
Rich Hill is trying to buildup a callous on his finger to prevent blistering;
Alex Wood has not pitched deep into games for a few years; and
Kenta Maeda has some arms questions (not sure what they are) that causes him to have his innings watched.”
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In short, every pitcher in the rotation other than Kershaw is a giant question mark.
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We are supposed to be encouraged when things aren’t going well because we are less than 25% of the way through the season, but it never works both ways. The Dodgers’ pitching, we are told , is #1. But we are never cautioned that we are only 25% of the way through the season, something that is only important, apparently, to explain when things aren’t going well.
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So – Hill will be our #2 in October? Really? The Dodgers are currently discussing whether he will even be able to continue as a starting pitcher – they PLAN on it, but acknowledge that he simply may not be able to do the job, in which case they will try him in the ‘pen.
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So what happened last year doesn’t count for anything? All Statheads tell us that the best predictor of the future is the past. You expect that Kershaw will pitch like an ace because he has done so before. Lester, for example, has been a big time pitcher in the post-season for both the Sox and the Cubs and has pitched deep into games. Will he do it again this year? I guess no one knows for certain but the best predictor of the future is the past and so to bet against Lester is a bad idea in my view.
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Which brings us back to the Dodgers’ starters. They pitched the 3rd fewest innings in the majors last year. I guess that some people think that is a good thing. I don’t. What will the same gang of pitchers do this year?
I am glad that Cody has the team lead in HRs now!
2B Taylor
SS Seager (L)
3B Turner
LF Gutierrez
CF Hernandez
1B Bellinger (L)
C Barnes
RF Eibner
P Wood P
Ian Happ’s 1st ML hit is a HR. Lester 5.2 IP (112 pitches). Not very deep into the game. Has not gone to the 8th this year, and to the 7th only twice. The other three starters only to the 7th once each, and none to the 8th. Maeda has gone to the 7th twice and 8th/9th once. Urias has gone to the 7th once (in only three starts). Kershaw has gone to the 7th 6 out of 8 starts, 8th twice, and ninth once. It does not appear that the Cubs are pitching deeper into games than the Dodgers. If Roberts/Honeycutt let the Dodger pitchers go 112 pitches, I would guess that there would be more starts going into the 7th/8th/9th. Both teams have excellent bullpens, so there is no reason for them to extend like the Giants have to. The Dodgers are winning; on pace for a 94/95 win season. So somebody is doing something right.
AC, I agree the Reds and Twins are off to surprisingly good starts and the Giants, Blue Jays and Royals to surprisingly bad ones. No sympathy for any of them and the Cubs pitching has been mediocre. With Houston I was surprised with an 8 game lead this early-no one else in the division is even at .500.
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MJ, Hill is lined up to take Maeda’s turn, not Ryu’s and I tend to agree Ryu should have had a rehab start or been held back from pitching in Coors where he has struggled. At least pull him after the first guy got on his last inning, they might have won the game. But when all 7 starters are healthy what do they do? I say 6 man and one to the bullpen rather than the 10 day DL shuffle or send one packing. The only problem is then you have a short bullpen or a short bench. There are 3 guys who could take the ball for a start or two pitching down at OKC also.
What I am trying to say is most pitchers cannot lay off for 10 days and then you expect them to be sharp. Some can. Ryu was not sharp, in my opinion. Not like the previous game he threw. I contribute that to his 10 day lay off, in my opinion. Pitchers are creatures of habit. Ask Kershaw.
We have very good starters. I am not even questioning that statement. Hill was hurt. Now we have them all back and healthy, in my opinion. Now we have seven starters for five positions. Now they are starting to juggle the starting pitchers. This is what I think is going on. They are using the 10 day DL to do it. Having a surplus is generally good. If these pitchers are truly hurt, then I am fine with the DL. If they are not and thy have to lie about their injury, then I am not ok with what they are dong. I dam sure would not want to be Roberts, and lie about an injured or non injured player. Again, this is just my opinion.
Have you seen the starting lineup?
Ryu did seem to be getting better each start and then 10 days off and he had arguably his worst start. If they were so worried about maeda hamstring why did they let him pitch his longest outing of the year? McCarthy was adamant he was ready to pitch and it was his no throwing shoulder but they have the luxury in being cautious. Hill was totally legit and I for one am glad they disabled him. I think I agree with McCarthy and hill but maeda not so sure and Ryu I think should have had a rehab start but hey let’s go wood tonight.
Mark
Even Kershaw?
They have done this to Ryu and Maeda. I do not like the way FAZ is using the 10 day DL. In my opinion they are using the DL as a strategy. Any pitcher that relies on command cannot take 10 days off and expect to be effective the next outing. Both Ryu and Maeda rely on command. If they want to send them to AAA for a rehab start and then back up, I can live with that decision. But to let Ryu sit for 10 days and then start him is wrong. Maeda is going to have the same problem. I agree with you MJ.
FYI, Ian Happ was just called up by the Cubs.
Very good post AC as always.
This is the way FAZ has set us up. Lots of Starting options knowing that the 10 day DL plays into our hands.
We have incredible depth & don’t forget we have the ammunition to relaoad at the TD if need be…
AC
I think the difference with Hendricks, Lester, Arrieta, and Wood, is that these Cubs pitchers, were able to pitch deeper into games, when it was needed last year, then Wood has, since he joined the team.
I didn’t include Lackey because I don’t think that is true, about Lackey at this time, in his career.
Maybe Wood will get better, at pitching deeper into games, by pitching in the rotation more on a regular basis, and with his new found, velocity.
I don’t think Ryu is as bad as he looked the other day, and I don’t understand why they are giving Hill what would be Ryu’s next start, which would be against, the Giants.
Because Ryu pitched well against the Giants the last time he faced them, he only allowed two runs, in that start.
What has Hill proven at this point, other then he may not have a blister problem, this time around?
I don’t think giving Hill Ryu’s next start, will help our problems, with the starting rotation, or will help Ryu.
It is to early to have these starting pitchers, to take ten days off in between starts, the season just began, and that is what they did, to Ryu.
The starters are trying to build off their prior starts, to get better, right now.
And giving the starters a ten day rest, is not letting them, build off their prior starts.
And I think if Hill had to make that start that Ryu did in Colorado, he wouldn’t have done any better.
Because of the way the altitude has an effect, on breaking balls, and how can Hill have any better command then Ryu has right now, with the few games he has started, and the few innings, he has pitched?
Hill hasn’t started and pitched in many games, and he hasn’t pitched beyond, only a few innings.
He also hasn’t even faced AAA hitters, let alone, major league hitters, how do we know he is more ready then Ryu is, to start against the Giants?
I think Ryu’s command suffered from the ten day lay off, they gave him.
And I think that along with the effect that the altitude had on his curve balls, is what did him in, in his last start.
And by pushing his next start back by two days, isn’t going to help Ryu.
Instead they should have Ryu make his next start, and have Hill make the start, that is two days later.
Almost every time Hill has started a game, he has not been able to pitch more then a couple innings, and this has caused the team, to over use the bullpen, that day.
Sorry Always Complete. I thought Mark wrote the post.
Great post AC, just outstanding! I can’t add much to your opinion of the starting rotation except to say Ryu has had trouble keeping his velocity up and his stuff may play very well in the bullpen and he would add another lefty to replace Wood who has earned a spot in the rotation. Ryu has 1 win and 4 losses as well. Maeda and McCarthy are both RHP and a little balance is needed with so many LHP. I like the idea of a 6 man rotation except for Kershaw more than doing the 10 day DL shuffle but whatever works is fine with me, hard to argue with the results so far.
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It is good to see Utley, Grandal and Joc beginning to produce, hopefully it keeps up and rewards Roberts for his patience and loyalty. When Forsythe and AGon return there will not be enough at bats for Taylor, Utley and Kike, unless Gutierrez is DL’d again. Someone will have to go down and it won’t be Utley.
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Dodgers with the 3rd best record in the NL and 7th best in baseball. Who is the biggest surprise team? There are the Rockies and DBacks of course but what about Houston with a very young team and the best record in baseball and an early 8 game lead? Or the O’s and Yankees getting just enough pitching to go along with potent bats?
Bellinger is just a good hitter. They threw him a high fastball the other night and he hits a home run. Last night he hits a low fastball for a home run. He reminds me of Yogi Berra.
Mark
I am not worried about our starting pitchers. We have seven competing for five positions. It is their job to figure out the five or six. Right now I would prefer the six man rotation. Kershaw stays on the five day, Wood to the pen, rest on a six day rotation. I know Ryu, Maeda and Urias could use the extra rest. Maybe McCarthy could also use the rest. Let them compete for the other four positions. Wood looks good wherever you put him. This leaves you with one less bench player. When Agon comes back and Bellinger goes to left field, you will have a starting eight. Forsythe will start at second when he comes back. That is what I would do. FAZ and Roberts will figure it out.
It looks like the league has adjusted to Taylor. It is now up to him to adjust.
Baseball, as families and life, has it’s ups and downs, good and bad. It’s a long-haul proposition that we need to be looking at. Viewing any part of it over a short period of time can and often will create a false narrative. When one’s own confirmation bias is added to the short term view it has the knack of creating a magnitude of misconceptions. Add a little euphoic vitriol and you can easily end up with…well we left that behind, didn’t we.
Your long-term view and acceptance of the bad with the good makes for a high-point vista from which to view the season. While most of us remain laserd into the Dodgers team, some seeing only the weak points, it’s good to be reminded that all teams have both strengths and weakness. And when you can’t have a team loaded with career year players or everybody you want, it’s nice to have the proverbial “depth”.