For the Final Time: The Bullpen was not the Problem

Friedman over-explaining why Dave Roberts’ Decision To Use Clayton Kershaw Out Of Bullpen In NLDS Game 5.

https://dodgerblue.com/dodgers-news-andrew-friedman-believes-clayton-kershaw-availability-out-of-bullpen-in-nlds-game-5-was-helpful/2019/10/17/

Really makes me think he had a lot to do with that decision. And that’s why Roberts is coming back next year.

How about this Andrew? Stay the freak out of the game planning conversation. You never played in the Majors, the stats don’t tell the whole story, you don’t know what the hell you’re doing when it comes to in-game decisions.

A stupid and crazy trade idea: Joc, Pollock and Rios for Stanton, a reliever and money .

Sorry, Sorry, I haven’t eaten and I’ve only been able to sleep 3 hours in the last 24 hours!

Agreed SoCalBum. In my opinion.

There are two chances of getting Torres: Slim and none. They might trade May, Lux and Seager for him.

Since Bums is throwing out trades, maybe I will throw one out. The ChiSox reeeeeeaaaaaaly wanted Joc last year. They have absolutely no LHH or SH who can hit with Joc. They have no DH. They are losing 33 HRs from Jose Abreu. Ryan Goins, Matt Skole, Daniel Palka are the LHH, Yolmer Sanchez and Leury Garcia are the SH, and they totaled 14 HRs combined. The only other SH on the roster is Luis Alexander Basabe and at 23 had a very mediocre year at AA (.246/.324/.336/.660 and 3 HRs). Joc could be a hero in Chicago with a very nice hitters park. They will need a 1B and another quality LH bat. Joc and Edwin Rios for Aaron Bummer. The ChiSox still have Colome’ for the pen, and they still believe Jace Fry will be a quality reliever. But I still do not believe that Chicago will trade Bummer who has 5 years of control without a significant overpay, and Joc and Rios is not an overpay much less a significant overpay.

Major breakthrough with the treatment of depression using magic mushrooms. All you need is a fresh cow patty and shake the shit outta that shroom over the meadow muffin. .

Okay now who in the hell says we go after Torres from NYY??

AND we start with Seager..

Have you seen Glaybar (?) play ball??

Dodgers News: Joe Kelly Dealt With Knee, Quad & Arm Trouble During 2019 NLDS

There are players that I like and would like to keep but have always felt they probably would leave when they reached free agency. Seager has been one of those players. It is with that feeling that I would be willing to trade Seager.

I think the Dodgers can keep Bellinger. I hope so. He would be the Dodgers best chance to get Glyber Torres from the Yankees but with Pollock showing he is no longer the center fielder the Dodgers need, Bellinger needs to be kept as the Dodgers long running CFer.

To get Torres’ righty bat in the Dodger lineup I would like to see if Seager would help get him. Seager gives the Yankees a much needed lefty bat. Are there other players that would have to be included in such a trade? There usually are.

Unlike almost everybody else, I am not a Verdugo fan, at least not a big one. To get another righty bat, I would offer him to Seattle for Hanigar. I have done that offer before but both players are coming off injuries and both teams might be more willing to consider trading them.

Bullpen:

1. If the Dodgers re-sign Hill, I would hope it would be as a Miller type relief pitcher at $5M plus innings pitched incentives.

2. I would make Maeda the closer but would also use a lefty in that spot against strong lefty hitters.

3. If possible, I would trade Jansen. Nationals?

For the umpteenth time, the bullpen was the problem.

Doc has repeatedly used or stayed with Kershaw too long because he believed the bullpen was the problem.

It’s one thing to bring in a key starter in the sixth inning to go 3 or 4 innings or to get one out but bringing in that key starter with 2 out in the 7th and leaving him in to pitch the eighth screams lack of confidence in the bullpen.

Staying with an injured Kelly after he showed he lost his command again shouts a lack of confidence in the bullpen.

We don’t have to make guesses miles away from the action about the quality of the bullpen. We just have to watch how and when the bullpen is used to know what the decision makers think of the bullpen.

Scott Boras represents:

Pedro Alvarez

Elvis Andrus

Nolan Arenado

Jake Arrieta

Adrian Beltre

Xander Bogaerts

Jackie Bradley Jr.

Zach Britton

Kris Bryant

Wei-Yin Chen

Shin-Soo Choo

Gerrit Cole

Michael Conforto

Chris Davis

Jacoby Ellsbury

Jose Fernandez

Prince Fielder

Carlos Gonzalez

Gio Gonzalez

Carlos Gomez

Bryce Harper

Matt Harvey

Greg Holland

Matt Holliday

Eric Hosmer

Lance McCullers

Mike Moustakas

Anthony Rendon

Francisco Rodriguez

Carlos Rodon

Trevor Rosenthal

Addison Russell

Hyun-Jin Ryu

Max Scherzer

Corey Seager

Stephen Strasburg

Denard Span

Troy Tulowitzki

Jayson Werth

Matt Wieters

The bullpen was not allowed to be the deciding factor in the playoffs. The playoff bullpen was not the same as during the season. The Dodgers had a definite bullpen advantage over Washington. But, because of Roberts poor decision making that advantage was erased. Roberts did the same thing during game 2 of the 2017 WS by pulling Hill out prematurely. The bullpen for 2020 will need some reinforcements. Hopefully, we can get some help from our farm system as opposed to signing a high priced or overvalued reliever.

I agree with Mark in that our stars (other than Muncy) failed, again, on the big stage. Muncy had OBP of .391 with 3 HR and 7 RBI. Our other big bats:

Bellinger – .211 with 0 HR, RBI with 7 SO

Seager – .150 with 0 HR, RBI with 8 SO

Pollack – .000 with 11 SO in 13 AB

I know it’s a very small sample sized, but come on. Can someone at least make contact with a baseball.

I’ve said this since he was a rookie, but Bellinger’s swing will never be successful against top of the line pitchers. Throw him a fastball 94+ between his waist and letters and he doesn’t have a chance to hit it. He can get away with against average to mediocre pitching. Why does he have to try to hit the crap out of the ball almost every time he swings. You don’t get extra points for how hard you hit the ball. He is so strong and athletic he doesn’t have to swing so hard. I think his approach is selfish. And, how does a guy so athletic have such a awkward swing against LH. Go with the outside pitch. Step into the swing. Don’t stick your butt into the first base dugout while you’re swinging.

Seager has similar issues with swinging too hard. He compounds that with poor pitch recognition. Or he may be committing to swinging before the pitch is made and if he guesses wrong it’s too late to adjust. I think with an off season to work on his game and not in rehab could be beneficial. I have a feeling Seager will have a much better season in 2020. I just think there were too many things he had to adjust to during the season such as arm and hip recovery and playing at a lighter weight. We’ll see.

As far as FA signings I think (like most on this site) Cole is the top priority and the only premium FA we should pursue. Rendon would be nice, but I don’t think the FO will spend on two “dope fiend moves”. It should be an interesting off season for the Dodgers.

I don’t have the exact stats in front of me, but I know that the bullpen turned a 2-1 game into a 6-1 game in Game 4, and then gave up six runs in Game 5 to turn a 3-1 lead into a 7-3 loss. The bullpen also gave up plenty of runs in last year’s World Series. But let’s not do anything to fix it, let’s just go out there again with the same people and hope for the best. Our bullpen gave up ten of the thirteen runs that the Nationals scored in the last two games, and thirteen runs in approximately eighteen innings of bullpen work in the playoffs.

The Yankees and Astros both have much better bullpens than the Dodgers. Washington did not this year, but it came up big in the playoffs, and they tried to improve it during the season, while we did not. There was no feasible way that the Dodgers could have won a World Series against the top two teams, because they would have eaten up our bullpen, much as the Red Sox did last year. But if we want to think that the bullpen is fine, then by all means don’t bother to fix it; it’s too effortful, anyway, and costs money.

It is very difficult to pick up a high-end starting pitcher. I don’t think we will get Cole, someone will outbid us. Maybe he’ll go to the Yankees, or maybe Padres or Angels. If so, where are we going to get this high-end starter? We probably wouldn’t, we would get someone who was good once, not so good now, but hope we could resuscitate him. As to Urias, I really have no idea how he would do as a full-season starter pitching a lot of innings. I do know that if we only have one high-end pitcher in Buehler, we would need a great bullpen to back up our iffy starters. If we don’t get that, and we go out there next year with Buehler, maybe some questionable pitcher we picked up, Kershaw, Urias, May, Maeda, we will not come close to winning a title next season, unless someone counts making the playoffs as “close.”

I suppose that just about any team which loses in the postseason in any sport can blame the loss on execution; i.e., if the players had just played better, they would have won. But to me, that is just a rationale for no major changes, thinking that surely we will execute better next time. Seven straight playoffs where we didn’t execute well enough, I guess. 106 regular season wins is impressive, but it obscures the fact that most of those were against non-playoff teams; and that the goal is to win the championship; and that had we won 130 games, it would not have made any difference as compared to 106, or 100, because the regular season and the playoffs are very different in the sport of baseball. It doesn’t seem fair, I don’t think the system is set up well, but there it is,; and a franchise which seeks titles must surmount it, and build a club which is set up well for the playoffs, with at least two really good starters (Verlander/Cole, Scherzer/Strasburg), a strong and deep bullpen, at least two really good hitters who can hit in the clutch, and a manager who knows how to make the right moves in the crucial late innings. As to which of those we don’t have, everyone is entitled to their opinions. I would say, none of them, except maybe the two hitters, but not in the last two seasons’ playoffs.

I agree with 2D2. Even though there are certain players that I would hate to see go to other teams, I would also wish them well and cheer for the new players who took their places. As to who that may be, I will leave it up to you experts as I am not knowledgeable enough to make those decisions. I do have my thoughts though, but they are based on basic stats, and what I see with my eyes and hear from everyone. You have been good teachers and I learn something from most of you.

Every team had bullpen issues this season… even Tampa Bay. I just get tired of the “parrots” saying that the Dodgers “have to fix their bullpen.”

If every team has issues, that must include the Dodgers. If they have issues then why criticize the people who openly recognize that and want to correct them. No one wants us to go into next season with the same issues that we had this past year.

The bullpen wasn’t “the” problem, but it was “a” problem. Some of the members of the pen, even if they did execute at the top of their ability, would not have been pitchers you could consistently rely on, particularly in a playoff context as is evidenced by the fact that starters were being called upon instead of those that plied their trade all year out of the bullpen. I don’t believe it would hurt one iota to get one or two pieces for the pen that might be considered more reliable and could be called upon in the playoffs. Then again, we could sign Will Smith and his arm falls off in spring training. If that happened, then all of us could wax philosophical about how we knew that it was going to happen before we signed him.

If we signed them, and we were guaranteed that we were getting the Gerrit Cole and Anthony Rendon of today, I’m sure we could find a place on the 40 man roster for them. But there are no guarantees that yesterday’s success will produce tomorrow’s victories. However, if Stripling and Kike had to be traded to make room, as much as I like them, I would wish them well with their new team and start rooting for whatever prospects we got in return.

Sorry, I just wasn’t a fan of the bullpen. An inconsistent lot at best. I was never quite sure if Pedro Baez was going to put out the fire or create a massive blaze, thought maybe he should get a new nickname … PG and E. Okay, maybe you have to live in California to get that.

Trust? I had none. Oh, there were times. I liked Maeda in that role, but when absolutely no one trusts your closer, you’ve got a problem. Friedman didn’t exactly give Kenley a ringing endorsement. There were all those communication issues between Jansen and catchers this summer. The catchers would call one pitch and Kenley didn’t want to throw it. He was a cutter guy, change was difficult. Roberts talked about it. Orel talked about it in the season wrap up show and what the Dodgers had to do moving forward. Obviously, the team hopes he will change. Will he?

MLB writer Jon Heyman is already linking Gerrit Cole to the Dodgers, noting his desire to apparently play on the west coast and be on a team capable of winning championships. He’s indicating the Dodgers are going to be serious about Cole, changing their approach from previous years. Think financial flexibility, money to spend.

So what about Cole and Rendon? Nah, I think you get one shot at this, not two. A $200 million vicinity contract is something the Dodgers won’t take lightly. They still have to extend long term deals to Cory Seager and Cody Bellinger in the future. And Friedman and the Dodgers will still want to maintain flexibility. They also have other needs, such as the bullpen. Make no mistake, Friedman still Thinks that is an area of concern. He was pursuing top flight relievers at the deadline for a reason.

Best of all worlds, Kenley bounces back and makes changes as Orel has suggested. Kelly is healthy and everything clicks in, and they find a couple of young arms in the trade market. Maybe they find a right handed bat, but Pollock had a terrific second half, but faded in the playoffs. If he’s healthy, the Dodgers will have a really good bat. They’ll probably look for a lefty who can get out both lefties and righties.

Maybe they pursue a Will Smith or maybe they don’t because free agent relievers don’t always work out, just ask Colorado. Plus such pursuits can be costly. Maybe they pick up Brandon Morrow or someone like him on a flyer and hope to catch magic.

They will give Maeda a chance to start, not wanting to bruise his feelings, but I think he’s really good in the bullpen and that’s where the team really needs help. Then there is Julio Urias, Dustin May and Tony Gonsolin pushing for starting roles.

I’m guessing Ryu won’t be back with Scott Boras already starting up the band to announce a big contract in his future. The Dodgers would certainly want him back, but at what cost? More likely, he signs with the Angels. For a few million more annually the Dodgers could have Cole. More risk, longer contract, absolutely. But the upside could be off the charts. As Friedman has repeatedly said, if you use common sense and logic, reducing risk, you’ll never get the player. Plus, they need to appease a somewhat angry fan base.

As to Justin Turner, you simply don’t get rid of the heart and soul of your team. He’s still productive, plus the fan base loves the guy. Deep breath, Dodgers are definitely going to make a few changes, but they’re not going to get crazy. They’re coming off a 106 win season and have won seven straight NL West titles. Pursuing a World Series title begins with winning the West. That’s not lost on the Dodgers. So radical change is simply not in the cards.

All that is needed is a lock down reliever,and a Solid RH hitter.

“It’s obvious to everyone (Andrew Friedman included) that Clayton is not a top of the rotation pitcher anymore.” Two weeks ago you were insisting that he’s still the Ace of the staff.

Conveniently, there’s no mention of the 6 years 140 million they gave to Patrick Corbin.

If my memory serves correctly, the Dodgers had a 3-1 lead, gave it to the bullpen, the torched the place, but somehow the bullpen isn’t the problem. Next series, the Nats won their first two games while scoring 2 and 3 runs.

Cole and Rendon are both the types of players that you make room for, regardless of need. I’ll take either one and preferably both.

If I had to choose between Rendon and Turner, I would thank JT and say Au revoir. File this under, “It’s better to let someone go a year too early than a year too late”.

“Kike Hernandez, Justin Turner, Russ Martin, and Max Muncy were 5 for 8 with Runners in Scoring Position, while the rest of the team was 0 for 29.” I think this has more to do with age and experience than anything else. Hopefully, with another year the youngsters will learn to slow it down and let it come to them in the post-season.

Cole, Rendon, Will Smith. Might was well go big all at once!

The bullpen was not the problem, when May, Urias, Gonsolin and Maeda were all members of the bullpen. But, you’re planning on pulling 2-3 out of the bullpen and into the rotation. You also have a closer with 8 blown saves, HR Garcia, Wild Thing Kelly, and Tire Fire Baez in the bullpen that’s not the problem. We need one or two RELIABLE bullpen pieces to count on added to this group. In other words, we need two unicorns.

Dodgers bullpen in 2019 (Fangraphs): ranked 24th out of 30 teams in leaving runners on base; 25th in blown saves; 30th in left on base wins (negative 4.6). The Dodgers have several areas to be addressed in the off season, one of which is the bullpen.

Scherzer and Strasbergs contract have deferred money, doesn’t affect the CBT but does reduce their actual seasonal costs. The Natshave already offered Rendon a deferred contract but seriously doubt he will rake it.