Bluto had a good comment:
The Grandal trade is borderline robbery.
The Chris Reed for Grant Dayton trade is ridiculously good.
OTHERS SAY:
“They traded away Matt Kemp”
“They sign injury-prone pitchers.”
That got me thinking about FAZ has done, and I make no bones about it – FAZ has made their share of mistakes. Olivera was a big one, but they recovered nicely and moved him. However, I do not consider McCarthy, Anderson and Kazmir to be “mistakes.” They were calculated risks taken because they did not want to be anchored to long term deals like they have right now with Crawfish and Gonzo. Jonah Keri of CBS Sports.com said it best:
After the 2015 season, the Dodgers had a glaring need for starting pitchers to complement Clayton Kershaw. But rather than spend $200 million-plus to re-sign Zack Greinke (or sign David Price), they shopped in the discount aisle, snagging Kenta Maeda and Scott Kazmir instead. Though Kazmir struggled with injuries and erratic performance, the combined investment in those two pitchers was about one-third of what Greinke and Price got on the open market, with Maeda posting numbers that topped Greinke’s and weren’t too far from what Price accomplished in Boston.
He also says this:
A Cy Young-winning ace in his prime. A Rookie of the Year-winning, world-beating infielder about to win a bunch more hardware in the years to come. A Manager of the Year-winning skipper liked and respected by everyone in the organization. A front office loaded with forward-thinking minds who value both present and future success. A passel of young talent poised to fortify the major-league roster for years to come. An old but beloved ballpark. A fan base pining for success after a long October drought.
The Los Angeles Dodgers resemble the Chicago Cubs in more ways than you can count. All that’s left is a World Series. They might now have the horses to do it.
OTHERS SAY:
“They gave Howie Kendrick away for nothing.”
“I want Dee Gordon Back.”
Ken Gurnick of Dodgers.com says this about the rotation:
With Spring Training less than three weeks away, the Dodgers have a high-quality problem: too many starting pitchers.
Veterans Scott Kazmir, Brandon McCarthy, Hyun-Jin Ryu and Alex Wood — each on the rebound from injuries last year — are on the outside of the starting rotation looking in, barring injury or a trade.
Clayton Kershaw, Rich Hill, Kenta Maeda and Julio Urias are the top four, with the fifth spot up for grabs among Kazmir, McCarthy, Ryu, Wood and young starters Brock Stewart and Ross Stripling.
Dodgers general manager Farhan Zaidi explained in detail last spring, that the Dodgers want to win now. But they also want to win for many years to come. As Zaidi explained, the best way to accomplish those twin goals is through a combination of data, depth and youth. Jonah Keri also said this:
“It’s possible that the team’s worst everyday player will be Adrian Gonzalez, a five-time All-Star who still put up numbers 12 percent better than league average in 2016.“
OTHERS SAY:
“They should not have traded Jose De Leon.”
“They were too cheap to sign Greinke.”
In the two years since FAZ has taken over, the roster has changed to the point where over half of the roster was acquired by FAZ… and they did that turnover while winning the Division (again) two times and getting deeper into the playoffs each year.
Again, FAZ is not perfect, but players like Toles and Liberatore, were also acquired without any major outlay. The Anti-FAZ Element wants to point to what they regard as their failures, but the fact still remains:
- They have built a team that is poised to become a dynasty;
- They are one of the deepest teams in baseball;
- They have stayed competitive while doing it; and
- They are poised to win THIS YEAR!
You can disagree with the methods, you can point to their individual failures, but collectively, they have delivered a superior product and you cannot disagree with the results unless you have lost touch with reality! Sadly, some fans have!
I SAY:
“Scoreboard!”
Photo of Logan White taken by me in his office in Spring Training 2010.
Discussion (70)
Disagree, not disagreeable
The twins were delusional. It was reported that they wanted JDL, Alvarez and Calhoun for Dozier.
The eyes are just as fallible as the data. You need them both. You may say, I have seen him hit a HR that was low and away, but then you find out it was 1 out of 76 pitches. The eyes remember, but the data has no reason to lie.
Like it or not, baseball is driven by data … more so than any other sport and it will continue to be even more data driven in the future. My eyes told me that JLD’s progress had stalled, but I suspect their data showed even more.
A new hire sheds some insight on how the Dodgers are trying to develop their pitchers:
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/brandon-gomes-on-joining-the-dodgers-pitching-department/
Dodger Digest has a post about Joc’s physical fitness and a picture of him that generated comments about him being flabby. I would guess that Joc and Duke Snider have similar bodies / body types.
The Dodgers’ bench is already crowded. There is no place for Utley. Think about it – they will have a 5 man bench. Barnes will be the backup C. Van Slyke and Toles will be backup OF (or maybe Thompson). Kike and Taylor or Culberson will be backup IF. Both of those guys play all of the IF positions; Utley can’t play SS; Kike can also play OF. Utley won’t be back absent a couple of trades.
I know this sounds kind of crazy, but I wish we could find some way to sign Chase. The Man was a huge part of the clubhouse culture last year, everybody loved the guy. I know baseball is just business , but I think bringing him back in some shape or form would be huge for the Dodgers this year
Toles, Ethier, Thompson, Gonzo and more or less. Shoot, I don’t know.
If we get him… we win it all!
What did we give up to get Braun?
I look forward to this lineup:
1. Forsythe 2B
2. Seager SS
3. Braun LF
4. Turner 3B
5. Grandal C
6. Puig RF
7. Pederson CF
8. Bellinger 1B
Toles, Ethier, Thompson, Gonzo = can we make that happen?
Just like any FO, FAZ makes both good and bad player personnel decisions. It’s easy to blast the Olivera and IMO, Sierra contracts. But we did get Alex Wood in the Olivera trade. I know many do not think much of Wood, but I am a big Wood advocate, and always have been. Even if he does not start (and he probably does not), I think he can be an Andrew Miller type reliever (no…not his ability).
The Dee Gordon trade will always divide the pro FAZ from the anti FAZ. Gordon had a great 2015, but was that juiced? He was also going to play better while he was at home more than he was going to be in LA. I think we will be able to better evaluate the trade after the 2017 season. My objection to the trade was paying Dan Haren’s contract to move him. We have no choice but to continue to evaluate Hatcher, Kike’, and Barnes. Dee could be batting champ again with 70 SB, Hatcher and Kike’ could be absolute busts, and Barnes may be nothing but a backup. Or… Dee will be like he was the 2nd half last year, Kike’ can resurrect his 2015 season and be the Ben Zobrist type super utility, and Hatcher can quit making that one pitch down the middle with no movement. He has skills, but lacks consistency. Maybe this is the year he puts it together.
Signing Anderson to be a 5th SP was not a bad decision. The year he was originally signed for he had 180 IP with a 3.69 ERA. I do not know what more you can expect from a #5 SP. It is not his fault he was forced to be a #3. He was signed to be a #5. The mistake FAZ made was to offer a QO for 2016. They wanted the draft pick. No player had ever accepted a QO before. I am sure they felt confident that some team would sign a young Brett Anderson to a J A Happ type contract. FAZ gambled and lost, but not because of the original contract. McCarthy has been a bust, but his contract is not an albatross. Maybe he justifies years 3 & 4, but certainly not enough to offset years 1 & 2. Hopefully we can enjoy two quality years as a SP or RP. Or maybe he gets packaged in a deadline trade.
Kazmir is not going to be a 170 IP. So those who are expecting 30+ starts at 6-7 IP are going to be disappointed, and say how horrible he is. But I think outside of Kershaw, FAZ is looking at 5-6 IP from SP and then turn it over to a lights out bullpen. Without considering injuries, I still believe that we will see 7 SP. With injuries maybe it becomes the 12-15 SP. This will allow Doc to limit the # of IP and to minimize the number of hitters having to face a 3rd time through the lineup. Maybe the 5 SP pitchers with 180+ IP is a thing of the past, or at least moving in that direction, just as the 4 man rotation with 300 IP is nothing but a memory. Times change.
As far as JDL for Forsythe, I am in the positive group. Forsythe improves the 2017 team more than JDL. I saw JDL pitch at Lancaster and he dominated with a lot Ks. While not at the same level, he reminded me of a 19 year old Felix Hernandez when he was with Tacoma at AAA. I saw him just completely dominate the River Cats. That was the best MiLB pitching performances I ever witnessed. I still believe that JDL will be at least a mid-rotation SP. But I think it is obvious that the best JDL was going to be this year was as a #6 or #7, and with Walker Buehler coming, they will not miss JDL in the future. Walker Buehler has 4 plus pitches. That is Chris Sale level. He does not need the comparison, and he still needs to consistently command them, but 4 PLUS pitches? JDL has 2 plus pitches with a killer change as the swing and miss pitch. By 2019, it will be Kershaw, Urias, Buehler, Maeda, and Alveraz. Yes I am expecting a Kershaw extension. With Stewart/De Jong/Sheffield/Wood/Stripling/Oaks/Sborz all potential #6 and #7 or quality relievers.
Mark, in the last few minutes I tried going to ladodgertalk and a note read I didn’t have permission by the server. I sent you an email asking if I was banned but now see that wasn’t the case, Please disregard my email.
I see Jon Weisman is leaving the Dodgers to go to Showtime.
He is one of the brightest and genuinely good human beings I have ever met. He will do well.
Good Luck, Jon!
Mark, Howie signed an extension knowing he was not going to be starting 2nd baseman right?
Mark 96-97 is some serious heat. Did you exhaust all possibilities of a career? Kendrick is kind of a mystery. I will long remember his misplay of the ball bryant hit and his frequency of hitting into double plays. He certainly was a consistent hitter until last year. Why didn’t the angels sign him back they were hurting for a second basemen? I kind of liked frias. I don’t know what his injuries were but I thought they were just stashing him maybe he was hurt worse than I thought. I never heard anybody say. I think Forsyth is solid but on a second division team he wouldn’t help much but with a better team like ours his skills will be maximized.
So – Howie Kendrick wasn’t any good. So, why did the Braintrust trade Dee Gordon to acquire him?
If he wasn’t good enough to play 2B last year or this, why did they sign him to a 2 year contract before the 2016 season?
Everybody see the new 100 Top Prospect list on MLB.com? The Dodgers are tied for second place for having 6 in the top 100. Braves and Yankees have 7 each. For being a perennial playoff team the Dodgers are very strong.
Cardinals lose their first two picks for hacking the Astros. Yikes! But they deserve it. The commissioner had to come down hard on them.
So, Carlos Frias goes to the Indians for a PTBNL!
We have 12 guys like him or better.
Chemistry is a wonderful thing and guys like Turner, Forsythe, Seager, Kershaw, Gonzalez, Grandal and others are rocks around which a team is built. Right about now, this is Clayton and Corey’s team, but the Turners, Gonzo’s, Forsythes and Grandals are all a part of it. Howie should have been a leader, but wasn’t. I’m not saying he was a bad guy – he wasn’t – it’s just that sometimes you are better off without someone.
“Sometimes you get the best light from a burning bridge.” — Don Henley
I still maintain that the team got nothing for DeLeon. It had Kendrick, whose offensive stats are as good as Forsythe, for one more year at 10 mil. They could have Kendrick at 2B with Calhoun in the wings for 2018 and De Leon, too. The team saved 4 mil, but Kendrick’s contract couldn’t have been the stumbling block. Forsythe may be a better defender, but that is hard to put in to a trade equation. Now we have Forsythe, with an option, and Calhoun is left hanging. I hope someone can clear up what the real problem was with Kendrick. I think he was healthy. He came back from hamstring issues in pretty good time. I think his body is younger than his age indicates. There must be something else. Otherwise, it’s JDL for 0. And the timing of the Kendrick deal left the team in a box for most of the offseason and in a terrible bargaining position. I think a big mistake. I want a credible explanation of the trade and the timing of it.
Mark, you’ve probably mentioned it before but how did you end up a Dodger fan if you grew up in Cincinnati area, or did you move there in your youth?
On a different note, have any of you ever been measured Pitching by a Speed Gun?
Recalling those games above reminded me of a visit to the old Jack Murphy Stadium in San Diego to see the Dodgers.
They had a Batting Cage and a competition to find the fastest pitcher in different categories, boys, girls, women & men.
Having played cricket to a high level at home in the UK, and being in my prime of about 22 years old, and having always been told I had a “good arm”, I thought I’d clean up.
I had 3 pitches and topped out at a massive 73mph. This was equal with the fastest pitch by a girl, and way behind the other 3 categories.
I couldn’t believe how poor I was. Since that day I’ve always found it incredible how anyone can pitch consistently at over 90mph & the huge stress that must put on the body, particularly the elbow. Obviously, I didn’t have the correct technique, but it was a real eye opener.
And the Dodgers lost.
Everyone,
I am not in favor of censorship, but I want to thank everyone for keeping politics and religion out of the discussion here. Sometimes the Dodgers are polarizing – I hate to think how it might go if I allowed Religion and Politics here. Let’s aggressively argue about the Dodgers, but we can all go someplace else for the rest of the crap. The Dodgers are real. Politics and Religion? Bahhhhhh…
Bum,
We know what you are doing and you can keep it up. Feel to get out all your looney ideas. I have a few myself.
Hi MJ
You mention Bo Jackson, and I was fortunate to watch him play both codes live.
I was at Mile High supporting the Raiders when he ran 2 TDs from over 50 yards, and saw him hit a HR for the Royals against the California Angels at the old Anaheim stadium.
He was a Beast.
Enjoyed Deion “Disco” Sanders too, and saw him play for The Braves against the Dodgers.
Maybe Zak Lee will be the next to play both….
Wait, he’s an elite athlete – Look how easy baseball was for Michael Jordan!
Oh, wait!!!
The Yankees were able to get Torres from the Cubs. The Nationals were able to get Trea Turner from San Diego. I am still waiting for FAZ to do something similar.
I guess the temperature in Hell has been sub zero lately as HanRam made Mike Petriello’s top 10 1st basemen and AGon didn’t. But HanRam always has had the most beautiful swing in the game and that……..
I meant “we”
If the results are as predicted, I stand corrected.
I’ve seen a lot of FO’s come and go over the years,
I can only sit back and watch.