AC made a very interesting comment In his Feb 5th article when he mentioned that Joe Kelly and Andrew Friedman most likely already had discussed the sign-stealing of the 2018 Alex Cora Boston Red Sox team. I have a hard time believing that the Dodgers would go forward with the Betts acquisition if they suspected a high level of malfeasance on his part. On the other hand, it makes me wonder about former Astro Tyler White, who I believe continues to be on the Dodger 40 man roster.
The latest exposure on the 2017 Astros cheating scandal that was completed by an Astros fan, Tony Adams, (astroscheatingscandal.com), reviewed each game in 2017 and determined that Tyler White was quite active in receiving the trash can bang notifications. He didn’t play much, but when he did, White received trash can bangs at a 26% clip, one of the highest percentages on the team. I’m wondering if White will be confronted or forced to address/apologize for the issue with the team. This is completely unrelated to the recent transactions, just an interesting predicament this player finds himself in.
Regarding the trades:
I hate losing Verdugo who I believe may win a batting title one day. Giving up five years of control on him hurts. And giving that up in exchange for only one year guaranteed of Betts may come back to haunt us of a Title isn’t won. As far as Verdugo’s future, let me just tell a personal story that a close friend of mine experienced.
Playing in Boston can be tough. Replacing a superstar even more. The press is brutal there. A childhood friend of mine out of Hacienda Heights, California was drafted by the Celtics the year after Len Bias’ death. Mike Smith was seen as a safe pick. First, because he was a Mormon kid out of BYU and the chances of another tragic result like the Bias incident were virtually nil. But he arrived in Boston with very high expectations, and they were quite unfair. He was compared to Bird as he was quite the outside shooter and he had similar physical attributes. Bird was starting to age and his back was giving out, and Red Auerbach announced following the draft, “He reminds us a lot of Larry.” It was the kiss of death for him. He was killed by the Boston Press corps as he made some rookie mistakes.
First, he bulked up before entering training camp because he thought he needed a stronger frame for the NBA. What resulted were difficulties in adjusting to the additional 20 pounds he had put on. A few injuries resulted, something he had never experienced. The press called him lazy. Truth was, he was hurt. But he played through it because he heard the criticism, even though he wasn’t near 100%. There were rookie mistakes as he learned the league: primarily turnovers and some defensive errors. Even though he had a ten-game run of scoring over 20 points each night, they absolutely excoriated him in the press, both Tv and print. His confidence was shattered. Long story short, he never panned out as an NBA player. When his contract was up, he was released and no one wanted him. Off to Europe he went and he led the league in scoring in Spain two consecutive years and was a virtual superstar there, but his NBA career would never go anywhere. Out of the league a few years into his career. My point: You either sink or swim in that city and there is NO ROOM for error. Alex will need to perform and be able to turn away from the press clippings when they rip him because it will happen. It’ll be unfair because Verdugo isn’t Betts, but Boston is Boston.
Friedman was stellar in not giving up the prospects. I’m amazed that he was able to pull that off. I love the fact that May, Smith, Ruiz, Downs, Gray, Gonsolin, Ferguson, Hoese, Busch, White, Cartaya, Rios and even Peters still remain Dodgers. If the ball club identifies weaknesses that need to be addressed at the trade deadline…there are still prospects to deal. Though I hope they don’t have to go that route. Ideally, they are able to move forward with the horses they have in place.
A full season of Betts is preferable to a trade deadline deal, such as the Machado and Darvish acquisitions in 2018. It’s always advantageous to land guys for the full season and allow them to learn team philosophies from Spring Training on. The Dodger organization is top-notch and I am confident that both Price and Betts will find themselves very comfortable from the beginning. Chemistry on the team is good and it is a winning chemistry where expectations are high. We’ll see if Betts is a good match. Sometimes players don’t gel in the new environment. Hopefully, Betts finds Los Angeles to be to his liking and that gives them the advantage in a free agency signing war during the off-season.
With Price, 3 years at 16 million per season is a steal of a deal. Had he been in a qualifying offer situation, he would have been paid more than that. Reports are that he’s throwing already and he has recovered from a cyst removal on his pitching wrist that was quite bothersome. Add to that, he’s not facing the bandboxes and powerful lineups in the AL East now. 10-15 starts at Dodger Stadium and then another 5-6 in San Diego and San Francisco will result in Price’s numbers improving substantially in 2020. I never gave Price much thought before this trade, but now I’m pretty happy about the potential with him.
Pederson’s 36 bombs will be missed, but as much as people raved about all his leadoff homers, I was of the belief that he never should have been in the leadoff role. Joc is a platoon guy and a complete failure against lefties. Though his muscle and pop will be missed, I see his departure as the opportunity for Matt Beatty to get some playing time and to shine.
Kike Hernandez and Chris Taylor appear to have diminished roles now that Rengifo is coming over and now there seems to be only one rotating outfield spot available in left. I don’t see a lot of opportunities for playing time for them between the occasional day off for Turner, Seager, Lux, and Muncy. Then there is the LF platoon that could be a rotation between 4 players. That’ll be a tough chore for Roberts to keep all parties happy, especially Hernandez who is in a contract year.
Stripling deserves a chance to be in a starting rotation. He’ll now get it in Anaheim. I’m happy for him. He was a good Dodger and he will be missed.
As far as the prospects coming over from Anaheim… I have no idea who they are as presently they haven’t been announced. The Dodgers through the Angels trade have cleared about $11 million and some valuable roster spots. I’ve got a feeling that they aren’t quite done yet. Kudos to Andrew Friedman for waiting things out and not rushing into a foolish deal. Patience paid off and he didn’t let the media or fan criticism affect his decision making.
NOTE: We are still awaiting final physical approvals to consummate the trades. They are not official.
Discussion (76)
Disagree, not disagreeable
Cassidy, I guarantee that there are no guarantees. Besides if there were guarantees there would be no reason to play the games. And that’s why they play the games. I guarantee it.
My buddy in the Angels org answered my text after a day.
Paraphrased, massively … “We don’t know WTF is going on. Somebody, Dodgers or whomever, has asked for medical reports and anything else about just about anybody worth looking at”.
Who knows what is going on.
But the lack of leaks concerns me. No clue if the Angels deal is only held up because reported medical issues related to primary trade with Boston/Twins. Or Joc’s arbitration.
Something don’t smell right.
I’m getting a bad feeling.
Although I do think that because the Yankees signed Cole it does guarantee them a WS championship. Last time. I promise
Can we please all agree to never use the word guarantee again. It’s a meaningless word in a baseball context and anyone using it in their argument just has no credibility at all!
Eric,
You keep referring to oddly formulated points. Betts is an improvement over both Verdugo and joc. Because he is a better player than both are.
I don’t know if it’s intentional or not, but you seen to avoid the basic logic that eight one WAR players are NOT superior to one seven WAR player. There are only nine spots in a line up, and 26 on a roster. You need to accumulate the best players at different positions to get the most “bang for the buck”
Three OF spots. Would anyone rather have Joc and Verdugo flanking Bellinger or Betts and Pollock? It’s a no-brainer.
Onto May. There are only do many starters you can have. yes he was and is on the 26, but now he is firmly in the six or seven man rotation. He wasn’t before Maeda and Stripling left. He may have been sent to AAA. This the equation is would you rather have the aforementioned rotation of:
Walker, Kershaw, Urias, Gonsolin, Nelson, Gonsolin, may and Price
Or
Walker, Kershaw, Urias, Gonsolin, Nelson, Gonsolin, Maeda and Stripling.
Again, at best it’s the latter, at worst they are the same.
Don’t must the waters with Dylan Floro, it’s misleading at best and stupid at worst.
What Eric refuses to see is that it is not Price alone replacing Maeda and Stripling. Somehow, he does not believe that Dustin May is good enough to replace either Maeda or Strip. Maeda and Strip would have ended up in the pen and the team does not need two long relievers. After all, that will undoubtedly be Tony Gonsolin’s job. AF has kept the kids for a reason. Time to move the middle tier and let the kids play, and let them prove themselves.
I am a big fan of Ross Stripling and I will greatly miss him as a Dodger. But I am ecstatic for him that he gets to start for LAA. But the Dodgers are better with Price/May/Wood/ than they would have been with Maeda and Strip. Price is throwing in Florida, and gives every indication that the cyst problem in his wrist is behind him. Before the cyst popped up, Price was good, especially for an AL East pitcher with all of those hitters parks and with the DH.
As far as Joc, he will be missed, but I will take the second half of 2019 of AJ Pollock. While Matt Beaty does not have the pop of Joc, he is not an underachiever in the HR dept. Pollock/Beaty/CT3 all had better slash lines with RISP and RISP w/2 outs than did Joc. But combined, they did not meet Joc’s 36 bombs. The Dodgers were not going to re-sign Joc, so they got what they could get, who happens to be a very good middle infield/corner OF utility player (floor) or a good 2B (ceiling), Luis Rengifo. Kike’ will be gone next year, and CT3 the following year. It is not that he was bad in the minors. In 2018 at 21 in AA – 181 PA – .305/.420/.477/.897 – 22 K…at AAA – 190 PA – .274/.358/.421/.779 – 22 K. He might have been a bit overmatched in MLB, but not egregiously so. He got good experience as a 22 year old. At AAA with 122 PA he slashed .273/.336/.464/.800. Unless Kike’ or CT3 are moved, Luis will probably start at OKC, and probably compete with Omar Estevez for 2B/SS.
I know, Eric, the Dodgers just do not need Mookie Betts. After all who needs one of the top five players in all of MLB who is a true 5 tool player. I know, I know, if the Dodgers would just trade for Ken Giles, they would win the WS.
And I really do not understand that you do not believe that good character and community involvement is necessary to build a winning clubhouse.
Not sure how you don’t see this deal as a positive.
Betts is the 2nd best player in baseball, on both sides of the ball.
Price replaces Hill for the pretty much the exact same salary. Who doesn’t take Price over Hill? Hill is great when healthy but at 40 and a body taped together with duct tape, a contract with him doesn’t look like a solid bet.
Pederson, while a great Dodger, is limited on what he can do for the team. He is a FA after this year and there just isn’t a spot for his skill set on a team like LA.
Stripling, while a nice piece, is not a vital one.
You can lament the difference in talent and championship quality from this team as constructed on Feb. 6, 2020 vs. the team that walked of the field embarrassed after their last game in LA last year and say they are not as talented.
I don’t agree but the argument CAN be made.
You cannot make a credible argument that the team as constructed on Feb. 6, 2020 is not exponentially better than the team that was on Feb. 3, 2020. Just not logical.
I have been a critic of AF for being way too conservative. This was a great move to go all in within the window that LA is in. That is all I have wanted him to do over the last few years. He finally did it, and I tip my hat. If he has more surprises waiting, I am all for it.
I am beginning to think that the Red Sox are back to their cheating ways.
They agreed on a deal and backed out. Everyone knows about Greateral’s arm and shoulder issues.
Now this? The Commissioner should investigate.
Great call Mark, CHESS!!! On LA Sportstalk radio 570 with Roggin and Rodney, Fred Roggin said that Andrew Freidman should be arrested for robbery. Just robbed the Sox blind. Him and Rodney couldn’t believe that during FanFest last weekend that some Dodger fans were booing Freidman. Bunch of idiots who have no clue how this dude rolls. Yesterday he showed it. And don’t forget, NOT ONE of our prospects got traded, so come July 31st when we might need some pitching, the gun is still loaded. Loved Joc, but as Roggin said, he got Puiged, meaning he had reached his ceiling with the Dodgers on what he brought to the table, but also what he wanted to get paid in arbitration, plus they had no intention of signing him to another contract when he becomes a free agent next year. They also talked about not sleeping on Price, he had a cyst in his wrist removed that was bothering him and he has already thrown a few bullpen sessions. David Vassegh also weighed in and said that one of the AL coaches texted him and said that Price is going to carve up the NL.Plus, and this is where Freidman needs to be arrested, he got the Sahx to pay half of Price’s salary. How in the hell did he pull that off?! So many of you guys over the years have blasted us “Church of Freidman” followers, but this guy has got to be one of the top 2 or 3 execs in the game. If you are not truly stoked about the direction he has us going in, go root for the damn Marlins. No room for haters on this site!
So, is Betts already a Dodger or is it still a Red Sox?
I!m pissed too. What’s AF thinking picking up one of the 5 best players in baseball! How’s that gonna help us!
I hate these trades and I hope they don’t happen.
So Betts is replacing either Verdugo or Joc.
Price is replacing either Maeda or Stripling.
Right there tells you that even if Betts is an upgrade over Verdugo or Joc he is not an upgrade over both and therefore even with a Betts upgrade the Dodgers are still downgrading at the other outfield position. AJ “I can’t stay healthy and wiffed when it mattered” Pollock full time is a downgrade over Joc (who starts against most pitchers considering most pitchers are right handed).
Same goes for Price, if he is an upgrade over either Maeda or Stripling (which I doubt), he’s not an upgrade over both. The pitching staff just got worse.
You watch, you’re going to see a hole develop in LF, if these trades happen. Then what? Let’s hope DJ Peters goes on a tear right out of the gate in AAA and plugs that left field hole.
Not to mention BETTS IS A 1 YEAR RENTAL I GUARANTEE.
The unspoken problem with the Mookie Betts trade
Alex Verdugo was credibly implicated in a sexual assault. Why doesn’t that seem to matter?
https://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2020/2/6/21124292/red-sox-dodgers-alex-verdugo-the-unspoken-problem-with-the-mookie-betts-david-price-trade
The Angels have a better chance of their outfield hitting 100 home runs than the Dodgers’.
Joc’s arbitration hearing is today. Definitely a unique situation! From MLB Rumors:
As the baseball world — fans and the industry alike — await the resolution in the potential hangup on the Mookie Betts blockbuster and the finalization of the reported trade sending Joc Pederson and Ross Stripling to the Angels, Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic tweets one possible holdup in the latter of those two deals: Pederson’s arbitration hearing is taking place this morning.
It’s an extremely atypical set of circumstances leading into Pederson’s hearing, as the Dodgers are reportedly in agreement on the framework of a deal that’d send him up to Anaheim at a time when they’re also set to argue his salary with an arbitration panel.
Had the two sides agreed to a swap involving Pederson earlier in the winter, the Angels could’ve prepped for a case in spite of the fact that Pederson has never played a game for them. That type of situation isn’t ideal for clubs but also isn’t unprecedented. As then-Angels-assistant-GM Matt Klentak told MLBTR several years ago in regard to Matt Joyce, whom they’d acquired in an offseason trade (and fortunately signed before heading to an arbitration hearing): “I still haven’t met Matt Joyce. I’ve negotiated his contract with his agent, we’ve traded for him, but I’ve never personally met him. … I’d really have hated for the first time I met this guy to be wearing a suit, sitting across a table, arguing over a million dollars.”
Viewed through that lens and considering the timing of the trade agreement, it’s only logical that the Angels wouldn’t be tasked with making the the case against Pederson’s camp on such short notice. They haven’t had time to prepare an argument for said hearing or even to try to come to terms on a middle ground between Pedesron’s $9.5MM filing figure and the $7.75MM figure submitted by the Dodgers.
Of course, the ultimate price point will in some ways impact how the two teams value Pederson. It’s highly unlikely that the outcome of the hearing will torpedo the trade, but it could determine which secondary pieces the Angels send to the Dodgers to finalize the arrangement. Given that additional layer of complexity, Jeff Fletcher of the Orange County Register tweets that an exec with another club “suspects” that MLB is having a third-party lawyer present the other side of Pederson’s case, thus entirely removing the Dodgers and Angels from the equation.
Between Pederson’s hearing and the reported medical snag in the Betts/Price/Maeda blockbuster, there are clearly numerous balls in the air that need to be accounted for prior to the completion of this series of significant transactions. A ruling on Pederson’s case should be known in the near future — arbitration results are typically known within a day of the hearing — which could bring some clarity to one of the many wrinkles in the Dodgers’ ongoing and extremely complex trade negotiations.
All we can really say about the Betts/Price get and the loss of Verdugo/Maeda are the stupid cliches that are pretty much so. Like, we shall see and time will tell. Questions I have are…. is Betts ultimately an expensive rental? Do Price and Maeda just cancel each other out? Will Verdugo end up a better player for the $$$$ then Betts? My dumb opinions are….I really don’t think this deal improved the Dodgers all that much but (insert cliche). Will it improve the postseason performances of (insert name of whatever Dodger players). My enthusiasm for the Dodgers ever capturing a championship or even long term competitiveness is way down these days. I’m not sitting on my hands waiting for spring training like other years. Guess many would say I’m just not a “real” fan. My enthusiasm for other things is down too. Like, will our nation ever become truly civilized and are we headed for a permanent right wing authoritarian kleptocracy. Guess many would say I’m just not a real “patriot”. Oh well, refer back to whatever cliche applies.
Could someone explain this page? I do not understand, how much is the current payroll after so many trades?
$215,791,667?
$216,542,500?
$218,251,000?
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/los-angeles-dodgers//payroll
Why don’t the Dodgers just keep Graterol and offer another player or players from roster or prospects. Our bullpen is our biggest weakness so why not Graterol? He throws 100+mph with a good slider. That’s what the Dodgers and fans have been looking for. Or, if his arm is an issue then just cancel the Minnesota trade and offer Maeda to Boston. They need starting pitching and he’s inexpensive. Include a low level prospect if necessary.
I still don’t get this Angel trade. After their top three prospects there’s not much to be excited about. The three are OF, and Trout isn’t going anywhere, so maybe one of them will be included with Rengifo. Read where the Dodgers get Rengifo and two prospects. Wait and see….just like the Dems in Iowa.
The Dodgers may have preferred to trade Pollock over Pederson but couldn’t make a deal that brought back salaries less than $1M. The Angels needed a lefty bat and while thin do have at least average infielders which allowed them to give the Dodgers a young and good infielder that can replace Taylor and Hernandez soon.
Yes, I would have preferred a Joc/Kike’ platoon and Pollock the one traded.
OPS+ in last 2 seasons (100 is average)
Max Muncy (145)
Cody Bellinger (144)
Juan Soto (140)
Freddie Freeman (138)
Nolan Arenado (131)
Bryce Harper (130)
Anthony Rizzo (130)
Paul Goldschmidt (127)
Manny Machado (127)
Kris Bryant (126)
$26M over 3 years for Muncy is a steal.
Dodgers and Max Muncy agree to a 3/$26mil extension. Deal also includes a 4th year at $13.5mil or a $1.5mil buyout.
I said if Boston wanted Verdugo as part of the trade for a one season rental of Betts I hope the Dodgers say no, now the trade is done and Friedman got both Betts and Price for Verdugo while sending Maeda to the Twins. If the Dodgers had to take on the full contract of Price and the still possibility of losing Betts after this season I would still have been against the trade, but Price now comes with half his contract being paid by Boston ( I have no idea why Boston agreed to that and only getting Verdugo from the Dodgers but they did and I think Friedman is due all the credit for this very good deal) which I feel is not a steal but very fair. If Betts can be signed by the Dodgers than I say great, great trade, if Betts is not signed to a long contract than I say Betts for one year and Price for three years at a reasonable cost is a good deal, Andrew Friedman, well done.
I thought about Tyler White and his Houston days. He only had 61 ABs in 2017, and his home numbers were sub-Mendoza while his away numbers were not much better, but at least above the line. He was also not on the WS roster in 2017. I am also guessing that White has been approached by both management and players with respect to the cheating. I doubt that we will ever hear about it unless Tyler decides to open up. I am also quite certain that he has been approached by Dodger baseball journalists. MLB clubhouse culture is about as tight-lipped as it comes, which is why Mike Fiers caught so much flak.
I do believe that when George Springer becomes a FA next winter, he will not be getting an offer from LAD. Some teams will give him an offer, but it may not be as healthy as he would have expected before the scandal. His numbers will always come under scrutiny, as will Correa’s the following winter. Altuve and Bregman are very fortunate that they have signed long term deals. I am not so sure that Josh Reddick will get many if any at all next winter.
The deal is held up over physicals for Grateral . It could come unraveled, but I think they will figure it out.
I’m not sure the Angels trade is complete as reported. I could understand Joc straight up for Rengifo. Not that they’re equal but to dump Jocs salary and get anything back makes sense. But to add a pitcher(Stripling?) and a minor leaguer doesn’t add up. Rengifo isn’t needed on our roster as he’s not much of a hitter and we already have 2 good utility players. Could the Angels be adding more prospects? And if so who? They don’t have many. Is Friedman planning to flip Rengifo? Or move either Like it Taylor? Stay tuned!