Believe it or not, this topic can generate some hot debate. Which players deserve the honor? And that is where the debate begins. The Yankees have by far the most retired numbers, 21. Number 8 and 42 are retired honoring two different players. 42 for Robinson and Rivera. 8 for Dickey and Berra. As we all know, 42 is retired throughout baseball.
The Dodgers have 10 retired numbers, 1,2,4,19,20,24,32,39,42 and 53. For Reese, Lasorda, Snider, Gilliam, Sutton, Alston, Koufax, Campy, Robinson, and Big D.
Usually, that is where the debate begins. Who else in Dodger history rates a retired number? All of the above save Gilliam, are in the Hall. Wheat played in an era where they did not wear numbers.
The Dodgers started wearing numbers in the 1930s. During his time with Brooklyn, Vance wore #15 for a while, then in his second stint, #21. But he only wore those numbers for one season each. So, none of his HOF accomplishments were performed over a long period of time wearing a number.
The Dodgers have had many great and near great players. The biggest Hall of Fame snub to me is Gil Hodges. Best of their era is one area that is always considered a part of the equation of a Hall of Famers credentials. Hodges was the best first baseman of his era. He was the rock of the Dodger infield.
He deserves to be in there with his teammates, Robinson and Reese. He was a very good defender and was awarded the first 3 Gold Gloves given to first baseman. He also guided the Mets to their first Championship. His death at age 47 from a heart attack was a shock to the baseball world.
Many have argued that Fernando belongs, and also Steve Garvey. I believe based on their career stats, neither makes the cut. You can throw Maury Wills and Hershiser in there too.
Fernando had one 20 win season and a single Cy Young. He led the league in strikeouts only once. But, as for his impact on the game, well, that is a given. He was a cultural phenom. He inspired a lot of Hispanic people and brought a ton of new fans to the Dodgers.
Fernandomania was an unbelievable time. He packed the fans in whenever he pitched. Stat wise though, his career numbers suffered from overuse and injury. He did throw a no-hitter and had a solid number of complete games. But few HOF pitchers end with a career record with only 20 more wins than losses. Statistically, he falls short. He may make it in someday for his contributions to the game. I do think his number is semi-retired. No player has worn #34 since he left the team.
Steve Garvey falls short simply because his stats for a first baseman while good, just do not add up to what was expected from the position at that period in time. He hit 30 or more HRs exactly once. Although he drove in 100 or more runs five times, he never led the league in that offensive category. In fact, other than leading the league in hits twice, he never led in any of the major categories at all.
He did win an MVP award in 74. And he earned 4 Gold Gloves. But his power numbers simply are not good enough to earn him a place in the hall or to justify his number being retired.
Maury Wills brought the stolen base back to baseball. He inspired many players to use their natural speed to impact games. Brock, Henderson, and Coleman took the stolen base to new heights. And Cobbs record was broken by all 4 of these players.
Maury was one of the better hitting SS’s as far as getting on base. He had no power. Although he had a 39.6 career WAR, which puts him above both Garvey and Fernando, he is not considered one of the team’s 24 best players of all time. What he did do was generate excitement. Not enough to get his number 30 retired though.
Hershiser is another borderline case. Orel finished 52 games above .500. You compare that with Drysdale, who had 209 wins and was 43 games over, you would think his 202-150 record would be enough.
They both won a Cy Young in a season they dominated. Neither ever pitched a no-hitter. Drysdale was 3-3 in his postseasons with the Dodgers, Hershiser was 4-0. Orel went to 3 All-Star games, Big D 9. But there the comparison ends.
Hershiser never led the league in the major pitching categories, K’s, ERA, He led in innings pitched twice. The biggest difference was Big D was part of 3 Championship teams. Orel was part of just 1. Granted they were different ERA’s and Drysdale was a guy who usually finished what he started. 167 complete games to Orel’s 68.
Big D’s career WAR, 67.1 is 23 points higher as a Dodger than Hershiser’s. Orel finished with a 56 WAR. He pitched for 5 seasons with other teams. Orel might make it in via the Veterans Committee. But as of now, that is not the case. So his #55 remains in service.
Don’t forget #22.
Kersh is a given.
I think the Dodgers got it right as far as retired number go. If you don’t get in the Hall, you don’t get your number retired. It’s a total joke that the Padres retired Garvey’s number. The Angels retired Rod Carew even though everyone knows him as a Twin, similar to Garvey.
I’m okay that Jim Gilliam is the lone exception just for the extenuating circumstances surrounding his death and the love he received as a coach.
I would be okay with Fernando being the only other exception based solely on Fernandomania. That organic phenomenon was unlike anything I’ve ever seen in baseball. More of a pop-culture icon, than a HOF worthy pitcher he was a Rock Star in a ballplayer’s uniform. The people have spoken in regards to Fernando and he had an incredible run unlike any other to start his career.
Some people argue that this person or that person should be in the hall. Gil Hodges is the one you see here most often. Sure, you can make a case for him. You can say he’s better than certain others that are in the Hall and that might be true. But when you’re on the borderline, that’s the way it goes. I would rather err on the side of caution than cheapen the greatest HOF in all of sports.
There’s a few “Magic Numbers” that get you into the Hall. If you wind up reaching just one of these numbers, you’re ticket is punched with few exceptions. These numbers are…
For Pitchers
300 Wins
3000 Strikeouts
For Hitters
500 HR
1500 Runs
1500 RBI
3000 Hits
If you don’t get to one of these numbers, I don’t want to here the complaining. This brings us back to Gil Hodges as he is often compared to Tony Perez as justification for being in the Hall. Their batting averages are about the same as are their HR totals. Neither of them have much “Black” on their Baseball Reference page, meaning they never led the league in anything. The big difference is Tony is the proud owner of one of those magic numbers. He finished with 1652 RBI and that was the difference in getting your ticket punched on not. It took Tony 23 seasons to get to that number, and Hodges fell 226 short playing in just 18 seasons while missing a couple of seasons early in his career to serve our country in the military. It’s unfortunate for Hodges and his supporters, but it is what it is.
The Hall of Fame is for the greatest players, it isn’t the “Hall of Very Good”. One thing that always struck me when considering if someone belongs in the hall is this. If you have to think about it, they don’t belong. I like it this way. Rarity is what makes it special.
No knock on Hodges, he was a very good, borderline great player. But, if you say he belongs, he would have to wait for Garvey to get his place in the hall first. Garvey had more Runs and more RBI than Gil and finished with a much higher lifetime batting average. Garvey just missed 7 straight season with 200 hits as he finished 8 shy in 1977. He was an ironman on the field, a 10 time All Star and an MVP with another 2nd place finish as well. And don’t forget about his 4 Gold Gloves.
Nobody is going to forget #22 Mark. Like Koufax, he’s probably not going reach one of those magic numbers unless he can pitch a complete season over the next year or two. He’ll get in on his absolute dominance during his prime years and those three Cy Young awards is automatic for me. Then you have to consider that he was absolutely robbed by RA Dicky from getting 4 in a row and he was close to getting 5 if it weren’t for Scherzer besting him in 2017. His 10 straight years of a sub 3.00 ERA is something most of us probably will never see again and is the most impressive achievement for me. Hs baseball reference page is full of black bold faced font and he would have had a lot more if it weren’t for his back injury and his unwillingness to go under the knife to get it fixed. Nothing is going to keep him out and 22 will be hanging on the stadium wall for everyone to see. It’s just a matter of time.
Bulldog, there are quite a few exceptions. The biggest bogus inclusion is Bill Mazeroski who was inducted in 2001 after being elected by the Veterans committee. Using your metrics ( which I think might be a little high) he didn’t even come close with his numbers.
HR – 138
Runs – 769
RBI – 853
Hits – 2016
Obviously, sometimes politics plays into a selection especially when it gets to the Veterans committee
Other recent inductees that didn’t meet your threshold:
Ted Simmons
Larry Walker
Harold Baines – barely made the RBI # at 1628, but played 22 years
Vladimir Guerrero
Alan Trammell – Like Maz, not close with any of his #’s
Jeff Bagwell – close on RBI and runs
Tim Raines
Ivan Rodreguez
Mike Piazza
Deacon White – Vet comm selection 2013. He played over 150 years ago. WTH?? Who wakes up and decides
that, yeah, Deacon White has been overlooked far too long. It’s time to get him in the Hall.
Barry Larkin – #’s aren’t even close
Ron Santo – ditto
Roberto Alomar
And, the above go back to only 2011. So, by your stat threshold (which I’m not saying is wrong) most of the position players selected for the Hall in the last 10 years don’t belong there. You could be right. It looks like the selection voters have lowered the HOF standards in the past 20+ years. And, still Gil Hodges can’t get in with these adjusted and projected stats:
HR – 433
RBI – 1504
R – 1307
Hits – 2016
How I got these stats? Gil had only 1 AB in 1943 so I didn’t count the season. He was in the military in 1944-45-46. I just used his Dodgers stats for annual average calculation because of his age and minimal ABs with the Mets. So, taking his 15 year Dodger career averages and used those averages for his military years which would have been at the beginning of his career. That’s how I got to the stats posted above. Certainly HOF worthy when compared to some recent selections. Bill Mazeroski??? Really?
Ted, you built this entire argument on a false premise. I said those are magic numbers that get you in. I didn’t say you had to reach one of them to get in. Kershaw won’t have one of those magic numbers, but he’ll get in based on the reasons I listed.
As far as Hodges goes, he wasn’t as good as Garvey IMHO. And I don’t think that Garvey was good enough to get in based on comparing him to others that played the same position in the same era. Willie Stargell, Eddie Murray, Tony Perez, Cecil Cooper, Willie McCovey, Keith Hernandez were all comparable or better.
With Hodges, he had competition from Ted Kluszewski, Stan Musial, Frank Robinson, Orlando Cepeda is his own era.
I think when you talk about the HOF, you need to be one of the top 2-3 players at your position in the era you played in, or you need to have done some else very special (Multiple MVPs), a shorter run of elite production or longevity that’s gets you to one of those magic numbers.
Noted. My main point was that many HOF players selected the last twenty years aren’t deserving of being in the HOF. At least not by my standards. And comparing players who played against each other at the same position never made sense to me. What if you have an era of average hitting middle infielders? Hence Bill Mazeroski. Compare him to the second basemen in the last twenty years for offensive production.
Anyway, this can be discussed forever. No right or wrong opinions. Probably why the controversy in the past few years on recent selections. I appreciate your thoughts on the subject.
Carry on.
Maz is not the only one. A lot of borderline players have gotten in over the last several years. Guys who have the stats, yet are included in the PED mess are still trying to get in. Kersh and Pujols will both be first ballot guys. I have never thought that Schilling was Hall worthy, but the last vote, he came close. The writers today use a lot different criteria to evaluate potential candidates. Hodges was a leader. Garvey was not.
You should have chosen Hodges competition better. # 1. Kluzewski. Big Klu had 279 HR’s. 1028 RBI’s. He did have a .298 career avg. He had a .993 fielding pct and no gold gloves. He played in one World Series. Frank Robinson was primarily an outfielder. He played a grand total of 305 games at 1st base. He played in five World Series. He is a no doubt Hall of Famer, but not as a 1st baseman. His career did not even start until 1956, Gil had already been in the league 9 years by then. Stan Musial played 1016 games as a 1st baseman. But he played 1890 in the outfield. The most games he ever played there in a season was 130. He played there more than 100 games exactly 4 times. Stan was in 4 World Series, none after 46. He never won a gold glove either. Orlando Cepeda’s career started in 1958. For his career he had 9 more HR’s than Gil and 91 more RBI’s. He played in three World Series and one NLCS. No gold gloves. To say he was a peer of Hodges is totally wrong. His career was just starting as Hodges was winding down. Gils career numbers are very close to his except in BA. Hodges played in 7 World Series
Here are his contemporary’s using stats in the 50’s where he played the bulk of his time and we will use WAR only… Hodges, 41.9 Klu 29.4, Bill Skowron 14.7, Joe Adcock 19.8, Mickey Vernon 22.0, Vic Power 13.6, Joe Collins 12.3, Ferris Fain 17.9, Eddie Robinson 10.4, Whitey Lockman 8.5, Luke Easter 9.6, Joe Cunningham 13.3, Dale Long 8.9, and Earl Torgeson 25.2. Those are the guys who he should be compared to. And he is heads and tails better than any of them. He was the BEST of his ERA. His numbers should have been good enough for enshrinement. And when he was eligible, the criteria was not as high as it is now. 400 was more the norm for automatic induction. 300 wins has always been a total that gets you in. Koufax broke that mold. Being a leader and character counted too. Oh yeah, Garvey’s career WAR is 38.1.
Okay OldBear. I agree with many of your counterpoints. But, to use WAR as a comparison is almost as useless at the stat itself since it wasn’t invented yet when his votes, or lack thereof were cast. I’m not going to keep arguing point by point.
Gil is the poster boy of being right on the line. To me, if you have to think about it, you don’t get in. Although he didn’t have much competition from other first basemen in his era, he had plenty of competition around the league and his own team. It’s pretty hard to get in the hall when you were the fifth best player on you own team. I’ll use 1954 as an example. It was arguably Gil’s best year, but Snider had a better year on that team in that year. That team had HOFers Pee Wee, Campanella, Snider, and Jackie. If you had to take one of them out to put Gil in, who would it be?
This is the best article I’ve seen regarding Gil and the Hall. If you go to the very end, the author admits that his is also on the fence. Again, enough for me to say no.
https://www.cooperstowncred.com/gil-hodges-the-most-hard-luck-hall-of-fame-candidate-ever/
Perhaps Gil Hodges should be used as the line in order to make the Hall. If you’re clearly better, you’re in. If not, it is what it is.
I will also agree that if you analyze every player in the HOF, you’ll find someone less deserving than Gil, but you’ll also find players that are more deserving that didn’t get there.
Well WAR was the best way in that case simply because none of those other guys came close to having his career stats. Another borderline case is Dale Murphy. Murphy had 2 MVP awards, but he hit 399 HR’s when it was felt 400 was the magic number. But you want to talk about a snub? How about Fred McGriff? McGriff has exactly the same number of career HR’s as Lou Gehrig. It has indeed become the hall of the really great and some guys who were meh. But Gil was heads and tails the Best of his ERA.
B & P, you mentioned 1954 as arguably Gils best year. Thus, the 54 in my posting name. Gil led all of MLB that year with 19 SF’s. He also led the 50’s decade with 1,001 RBI’s, I don’t remember if that was for the NL or all of MLB. I’m just giving some tidbits of info. I’m not debating whether Gil should be in the HOF. As much as I would as I would love to see it, I’m not a good Knowledgable debater. I’ll leave that to Bear and others.
Okay, I don’t pay much attention to the Hall of Fame. Great honor for the players and others who make it and I love the history of the game.
That said, it would be perfectly okay for the hall to honor Gil Hodges. Vin Scully said he deserves to be in the hall and that’s good enough for me.
So what about Steve Garvey? Again, he was the pillar of those teams, exceptional hitter. I’m okay with Garvey too. Like all awards, a lot of this stuff is subjective. Fernando was certainly a cultural phenomenon and those don’t happen all that often. Whether he should be in the hall or not is another story, but he should be acknowledged. Same thing for Orel. Maybe the Hall does that, never been there so I don’t really know. I do want to visit.
But honestly I never watch the ceremonies. I was disappointed that Mike Piazza went in as a Met. I’m still incensed that a couple of clueless Fox execs chose to trade the face of the franchise. Oh well. That’s I like about the current ownership group. They prioritize baseball, not TV deals and LA mansions. When Clayton Kershaw goes in I will probably pay a little more attention. Kershaw is just special, not only as a player, but as a human being.
As to others who should be in the Hall, I would argue Shoeless Joe Jackson should be in and no doubt Pete Rose too.
As to the steroid issue, eventually I expect some of those players to be inducted.
What I think really needs to happen is for the Dodgers to create a Hall of Fame at Dodger Stadium. If it were me, I would like to see them front the entry like old Ebbets Field, cool connection to the past. But an actual museum is what they need. They certainly have the room. Then you could honor all the various players and great moments over he years.
Two excellent stories about the Dodgers on the front of LA Times sports section this morning about the team’s free agents, covering each individual player, and a list of potential suitors along with the Dodgers. Another article covers potential free agents the Dodgers may pursue and the reasons they might be a good fit.
The Dodgers definitely want Max Scherzer back and a contract of around three years and a hundred million is the projection. It probably boils down to what Clayton Kershaw wants to do. If he wants to return, pursue another championship, a deal will be worked out.
As to Corey Seager, the Dodgers apparently tried to work out a mid-season deal, but weren’t able to get it done. No surprise with Scott Boras as his agent. The feeling is the Dodgers definitely want Seager to return, but his time at short is coming to an end. They don’t want to lose the bat and a player who came up through the system, especially entering his prime years. The issue for Seager is a history of injuries. Okay, getting hit by a pitch and breaking the wrist, is not part of that concern. But he also had hamstring issues again this year.
There is a suggestion the Dodgers may be open to trading Trea Turner if they retain Seager, but that doesn’t make much sense based on what Andrew Friedman said about Turner’s value to the team — speed, steals bases, hits for both average and power.
I think it would be a perfect storm if they can resign Seager, Kershaw and Scherzer. After that, work around the edges and improve the bench. CT3 is not a must sign for me. I love him, but 20 HR and 160 Ks is not a ratio you have to pursue.
I agree, that trading TT is just nonsense. The only place I’ve heard such a bad idea is on this site where crazy ideas grow like weed plants in California backyards.
It’s no wonder that Bob Melvin is leaving his job with the A’s to go to the warm weather and a team willing to spend money. It seems that the A’s are going full rebuild with the following players looking to be the top trade targets for teams looking to improve…
Frankie Montas RH SP
Chris Bassitt RH SP
Sean Manaea LH SP
Matt Olson – 1B 39 Bombs topped 100 runs and 100 RBI to go along with 88 BB and just 113 K’s
Matt Chapman – 3B – 202 K’s this year
Tony Kemp – Utility Left Handed Bat 279 Batting Average and 382 OBP
Starling Marte Free Agent CF 47 Stolen bases while hitting over 300
A few years ago the Dodgers started handing out bobbleheads for what they called, Legends of Dodger baseball. So far, Fernando and Garvey along with Newcombe have been so honored. There is a level at the ball park that contains many pieces of Dodger history including silver slugger bats, world series trophy’s, uniforms, and other items. But I think the only way you can see this stuff is to take the stadium tour. I disagree about Garvey. His power production for a 1st baseman in that era just does not add up.
Zack Wheat, Fernando, Gil Hodges and Maury Wills all belong in the Dodger Hall of Fame and should have their numbers retired (although I don’t have a clue as to which number Wheat wore). Just my opinion.
Wheat is in the Hall. But they did not wear numbers back then. The Dodgers do not have a hall per se.
To what extent is/should be defense be considered in HOF voting?
BP we will probably never agree on Hodges and that is cool. I saw him play, and I saw Garvey play too. I liked Garv, but his numbers fall far short when you compare him to his peers and those already in the Hall. You said it is not the hall of the very good. Well, lately, that is exactly what it is.
I never said Garvey should be in. But, based on numbers he’s ahead of Gil.
It doesn’t matter if you’ve seen both play and Gil is better in your opinion and in your memory. It doesn’t matter if you view Gil as a leader and Garvey wasn’t. On his own team, everyone says Pee-Wee was THE leader. On Garvey’s team, I don’t think you can choose someone who was more of a leader on THAT team. As I remember it, Garvey was the leader of that team.
If he Gil was elected to the Hall, I wouldn’t argue that he shouldn’t be there. Like I said, he’s on the line and I don’t feel strongly about players on the line, just like Garvey.
Well the elephant in the room is respect. Gil was universally respected in the Dodger clubhouse. Garvey on the other hand was not. But we could argue the point all day. I simply disagree with your assessment of Hodges. Always will. Like I said, the subject always inspires debate.
Since I grew up watching the “boys of summer”, I thought I would weigh in. I am personal friends with Eddie Murray and obviously greatly admire what he accomplished. If you compare his Hall of Fame numbers to Gil Hodges’ numbers, you will see a great deal of similarity. Add Tony Perez (in the Hall) to the mix and the case for Hodges becomes stronger. Finally I added Garvey just as a means of comparison. Here are the numbers:
Player Yrs AS Games HR/162 RBI/162 BA OPS OPS+
Murray 21 9 3026 27 103 .287 .836 129
Perez 23 7 2777 22 96 .279 .804 122
Hodges 18 8 2071 29 100 .273 .846 120
Garvey 19 10 2332 19 91 .294 .775 117
I feel this clearly shows that compared to the 2 players already in the Hall, Hodges actually has better numbers in several categories. I’m sorry B&P but the only area Garvey has better numbers than Hodges is BA and he also made more all star teams. I watched Gil play many times in person and the fact that he is not in the Hall is a travesty.
From 1974 to 1983, he led all first baseman in home runs, extra base hits and total bases. During that time, he also had the highest WPA and RE24 among first baseman.
First Baseman*
Total Bases
Home Runs
Extra Base Hits
WPA
RE24
Steve Garvey
2785
200
536
29.2
287.5
Cecil Cooper
2549
193
531
20.4
227.7
Chris Chambliss
2314
145
465
14.0
131.3
Tony Perez
2036
159
447
11.5
130.3
Eddie Murray
2007
198
421
26.4
227.5
Keith Hernandez
1964
90
416
22.5
259.3
I believe they both belong in the Hall of Fame. As far as home runs go Hodges played in a band box Ebetts Field compared to dodger Stadium
Garvey and Hodges played in different ERAS. Hodges had more of a dead ball. Garvey played in a liver-ball era. Hodges’s was a team leader, if not the team leader and was highly respected. Garvey was mocked… not respected.
Exactamundo. Hodges started as a catcher. He was Bruce Edwards backup. Robinson played 1st in 47. Hodges did not take over there full time until 49. I think fielding excellence plays into the selection. It did with guys like Ozzie Smith and Maz. They sure were not elected because of their batting prowess. More food for thought, how many pitchers from the Boys of Summer are in the Hall? None. Koufax was a bonus baby and contributed little while they were in Brooklyn. Drysdale did not make it to the majors until 57. Newk, Roe, Erskine, none of their main starting staff even sniffed the hall. They beat you with their bats.
Not so fast. OPS+ would normalize the differences between eras. Hodges 120 career OPS is just 3 points higher the Gavey’s 117. Hodges 8 All Star selections Garvey 10. Hodges 3 GG, Garvey 4. Hodges best MVP showing was 7th, Garvey has an MVP and finished 2nd in another year.
They were both very good players. You can argue who is better all you want. Garvey has more Runs, RBI, Doubles and a higher BA. Hodges rates stats are better except batting average and only led Garvey in homers. They’re pretty much even Steven or Stephen, whichever you prefer. The one thing where Garvey beats him hands down in in the postseason with a career slash of .338/.361/.550/.910 vs .267/.349/.412/.761. Garvey also put up his numbers as a 3 4 5 hitter with by far most of his ABs as a cleanup hitter. Hodges mosty batted 5th and 6th throughout his career. So Garvey did it with more pressure having to be the guy while Hodges was never the guy on his own teams.
At the end of the day, neither are in. If either were as great as your old ass memories serve, they would be.
I will also point out for those that say they watched Gil play. Baseball games were rarely televised in the 50’s and even into the 60’s. It wasn’t until the 70’s when you could watch players on a regular basis. So, I doubt highly that you can tell by the games you watched who was better between 2 players that played their prime years 15 years apart from each other.
It’s like saying chocolate is better than vanilla. They’re really too close to make a determination. To me, Garvey gets bonus points for having the consecutive games played record for the NL and he was arguably more important to his team than Hodges was to a team that featured 4 Hall of Famers.
….”Steve Garvey falls short simply because his stats for a first baseman while good, just do not add up to what was expected from the position at that period in time.”
Maybe that is another reason Seager wants to stay at shortstop. His stats are awesome for a shortstop but third base has a higher threshold if decisions are to be stat based.
The Dodger infield of Cey. Russell, Lopes, and Garvey should have recognition on the retired number display at Dodger Stadium. Just group their numbers together to recognize the whole instead of the other retired numbers that recognize the parts.
If Rose can be eliminated from the Hall for negative character traits then Hodges should be included in the Hall for positive character traits and since the Dodgers can’t control what the Hall does, it can retire his number to recognize what Hodges meant to the Dodgers.
There are a very few players that transcend mere stats due to their impact on a team, the public, fans, and culture. Fernando was loved by all and lifted the souls of the Hispanic fans in LA. He should definitely have his number retired and I haven’t even talked about his time in the radio booth.
Name another player that revved up fans more than Maury Wills, okay maybe Game Over but for a shorter period of time. Fans want to be entertained and Wills did that as much as any player whose number has been retired. Who thinks someone who hits 500 home runs over 15 years and strikes out maybe 30% of the time created as much fun as did Wills? The stolen base was dead and Wills revived it. Others followed but he lead. Wills should have his number retired.
I’m thinking Don Newcomb should have his number retired as well.
” Wills should have his number retired.”
Is this your subtle way of saying you want Doc fired?
Doc can wear it while he is Manager but otherwise it would be retired and on the wall. It’s a minor flaw I overlooked but not as if I asked Mrs. Lincoln other than that did you like the play.
STB, do you agree? About Wills that is.
Emotionally, I agree. Logically, I’m not sure.
Not the way it works Bum. You would have every number on the team retired in some form or another. Wills is an interesting case. Hodges got 63pct of the vote his last year of eligibility. Wills got 25.6 and never more than 40% in all the years he was on the list. Wills brought back the stolen base for sure, and he generated a lot of excitement. But if you were using that as a gauge, you would have to consider Puig. He was both exciting and frustrating at the same time. He is trying to get back to the majors by the way at age 31. He paid the lady who had made the sexual assault allegations. All those guys have something of theirs in the Hall on display, but as a whole, their accomplishments on the field falls way short. Newcombe, as good as he was came no where near having hall creds. Some, like Newk, have to settle for kudos given by their team Newk is one of 3 who have been designated ” Legends of Dodger Baseball” The other two are Fernando and Garvey. Yankees have retired 21 numbers, including all the numbers from 1-10.
I’ve been catching up on my Dodgertalk reading today. Had to share a pizza I originally thought no way. Turned out to be one of my favorites. Mustard based with pastrami and pickles. Awesome.
PS: I like pineapple, sausage & and jalapenos too! Got to be good Italian sausage though.
When you say mustard based, is that more or less subbing the mustard for the usual tomato sauce?
And, I want to know if it is Grey Poupon.
Yes, Singing, and it wasn’t Grey Poupon. It was at a pizza place. It was on the menu.
I asked a German friend of mine what the square root of 81 was. He said no.
Your friend should’ve said “neun”.
But it would not have been as funny of an answer
Nope, Gil is not in the hall, and it is what it is. Old ass? Just because we are old, does not mean we are senile. To me the best gauge of whether he should be in or not is Vin Scully. Scully saw Gil play almost his entire career. His response was simply Gil belongs. That is good enough for me. Give respect get respect there B&P. I respect your opinion even though I disagree. Your wise ass mouth not so much. By the way, Hodges only has 3 gold gloves because they did not start giving them out until 1957.
Pasadena police have concluded their investigation of the Bauer incident. Joc Pederson has not had a good World Series.