Cheaters Lose!

This article has 39 Comments

1. Correa has to know he is a piece of $#^!. And I’d happily go into a fight with him believing he’d win at the end of it because I can assure you he wouldn’t come out of it smelling like a rose. It don’t matter how good of a player he is because he can’t reach a level of play that can erase who he really is. Any team he’s on in the future I will hate the same.

   1. I’m with you. He’s one of my most hated players. Certainly, my most hated cheating Astro big mouth. Machado and Tatis Jr. are right up there with him.

2. I thought it was unnecessary to pull Kersh last night with two outs in the 8th, nobody on, right after a double play at 81 pitches. Did Doc make that move to put Kelly into the game just to mess with Altuve and the Astros? I can’t think of any other reason to do so.

   The game was a good old fashioned Ass-beating. A good outcome facing the cheaters in front of fans for the first time after the Cheaters were outed. The Blue Crew travelled well overtaking their stadium with an estimated 40% Dodgers fans. I would imagine more of the same today with a slightly earlier start at 4:40. I can’t imagine Pantone 294 travelling to Houston to go to just one game in a two game series.

   I’m looking forward to Bauer pitching today as I wonder what he’ll do to get under their skin. Kelly threw just 4 pitches. Maybe they can bring him back tonight to plant one on Correa.

   Just a few days ago, it appeared that Belli wouldn’t be coming back until after the Giants series. Now, Doc says it’s a possibility he returns this weekend. I wonder if there’ll be a bullpen game during the Giants series, or if they’ll decide it’s better just to bring Gonsolin back this weekend as well.

   ZMack was 3-4 last night. I’m missing that contact bat in the lineup and I’m very excited to get him back into action.

   Seager’s been out 10 days now and Pollock’s been out 11. It’ll be a while longer until we’re full strength. Not a bad run so far with half the offense on the IL, yet people here are still complaining about the bench and depth. Bullpen haters have been really quiet lately.

   1. I think Gonsolin can’t come back until June 3rd/4th.

      1. I looked it up…

         Gonolin was placed on the IL retroactive to Thursday, April 1, so he’ll miss the Giants series. But, he’ll be eligible to come off the DL on the 31st against the Cards. Bullpen game most likely.

         Bauer has mentioned the desire to pitch every 4th game. Sunday start? Probably not likely, but possible.

   2. No Pollock, Belli, Seager, ZMac … not to mention the fact that Betts just hasn’t been playing all that well. Even his defense has been poor this year, which is uncharacteristic. I don’t know what’s going on, whether it’s just nagging injuries that have slowed him down, but if we can anticipate he bounces back at some point and starts putting up Betts-like numbers in the second half, he’s the kind of player who can turn a team around. So far he’s not been a big net positive. Right now it’s been Muncie and Lux and CT3 who have carried the offense during the current win streak.

      I’m a bullpen hater and I won’t be silenced. I don’t know who Phil Bickford is but I don’t want to be hearing his name in September. Ok, fine. If the pen is suffering injuries and Roberts wants to have his extended Spring Training tryouts for pitchers over the course of the regular season, he can have at it, but this needs to get settled by August. If Knebel, Brusdar, Nelson, et al can’t contribute and we’re still seeing Santana or Mitch White or whomever, you better hope the Cubs start to tank so they put Kimbrel on the market, because Phil Bickford pitching against Aaron Judge in the WS isn’t going to get it done.

      And any bench that has Albert Pujols on it is a bench I don’t like.

      1. Yeah, the Dodgers are a real train wreck. Do you really think that if the injured relievers were active right now that Bickford, Uceta, N Jones, Santana would even smell a big league game? Of course not. Somebody has to take the place of the injured. Who would you have in the BP right now while the infirmed recover? Even with these guys pitching the BP is doing OK.

         Like you mentioned the team is winning without Bellinger, Mckinstry, Seager, and Pollack. I think it’s incredible they are winning right now especially against some good teams. These AAA guys in the BP are at least getting some major league experience and exposure without costing us much in the way of losses. Sure, some anxious moments. All part of development of players in the system. When the injured recover and/or others are traded for by August I hope they meet your standards. I know there will be hell to pay if that’s not the case. We’ll see what happens.

         1. Train wreck alright (I’m reading that as sarcasm, correct me if I’m wrong).

            I’m not sure if anyone checked the standings lately. I’ll save you all the trouble. Second best record in baseball, a half game back of the best record in baseball, a half game ahead of the Third best record in baseball, all sitting in the same division making it the best division in baseball, with (over?) half of our 25 man roster on the IL.

            I don’t even think about having guys like Bickford on the Post-Season roster. Sure, it could happen, but only if he suddenly becomes “Insert back end reliever here”.

            I don’t expect a lot of trades to come at the deadline. Why would I when the team is a half game behind the best record and half the team is on the IL?

            Albert has not been the second coming of David Freese. But, I’m willing to ride this out a little longer. He’s a big right handed bat off the bench that puts together a quality AB with potential to put forth some damage. When CT3 and ZMack are forced back into Super Utility roles, we can afford to have a guy like Albert who’s a little less than one dimensional. A guy that can thump lefties.

            If Albert fails during this tryout, maybe we can try again by prying Ryan Zimmerman away from the Nats.

            1. “I’m not sure if anyone checked the standings lately. I’ll save you all the trouble. Second best record in baseball, a half game back of the best record in baseball, a half game ahead of the Third best record in baseball, all sitting in the same division making it the best division in baseball, with (over?) half of our 25 man roster on the IL.”

               Yeah, that’s great! If the playoffs started today, would you have confidence that the Dodgers could beat the Padres, Red Sox or Yankees in a seven game series with their current relief corps and bench?

               Yes, I know it’s early, and injured guys can and will get healthy and things change …but if they don’t.

               And Pujols is basically free, so why not take a flyer and see what happens, but you usually get wht you pay for. I like the Zimmerman idea better.

            2. DodgersPatch, the playoffs don’t start today and we aren’t even 1/3 of the way through the season.

               I guess with the short season last year, it’s also hard for the fans to adjust to the 162 game season.

               I understand that Seager, Belli, ZMack, Pollock ,Gonsolin, Graterol, Knebel, Alexander, Cleavinger and Nelson are all on the IL right now and there’s no reason the think they won’t be healthy in 4 months when the post-season rolls around. When those guys come back, it’s very easy to see that there won’t be room on the 26 man for guys like Peters, Neuse, and two of Pujols, Tsutsugo, Beaty or ZMack. In the pen Uceta, Santana and Bickford are demotions. Alexander, Cleavinger and Vesia all share the same bullpen role as third lefty, so only one is necessary.

               So, while I may be hesitant in my confidence going to war with the current 26 man, I am absolutely confident in going to war with the current 40 man.

               No need to get jumpy.

         2. Do you want the Dodgers to win the World Series or not?

            “Yeah, but these AAA guys are getting valuable experience in the big leagues.”

            Yeah, that’s great. I’m sure they’ll have some nice stories to tell their grandkids. Do you want the Dodgers to win the World Series or not?

            The Dodgers will not win the World Series if there are guys like Edwin Uceta or Mitch White or Phil Bickford , or Vesia on the roster in September.

            The Dodgers will not win the World Series if, because of injury, Albert Pujols is the starting first baseman in September.

            Full Stop

            Do you want the Dodgers to win the World Series or not?

            “yeah, but injuries! What is AF supposed to do?”

            I understand. I don’t blame the front office or Roberts for putting those guys in there, or signing Pujols. At this point there is not much else they can do, but these aren’t long term solutions to a problem. If the problem persists, then it is up to them to find another solution, perhaps through a trade after the ASB.

            I think it was Philjones who argued with me that the Pujols move was an example of AF making the team better. No. There’s a difference between making a team actually better and putting a thumb in a dike to plug a leak. Pujols is warm body. He’s not a solution if, heaven forbid, Muncy gets injured and is out for the playoffs. The Dodgers have literally no one else who can consistently play first base.

            If all our position players are healthy and the Dodgers have a healthy Knebel, Nelson, Price, Gonsolin, and Brusday, and Kelly is pitching well, the Dodgers are in good shape to repeat. If they are not, then they won’t repeat.

            1. Why do all these assumptions of yours come become facts? If this happens, if that happens this is what is going to happen. Comments on what is now actually happening is fine. What might happen in the future and come off that you know what the result would be is pure fantasy. Like the rest of us, you don’t have any idea what’s going to happen. Hell AF doesn’t know what’s going to happen. What leak did the Pujols addition plug? Muncy , Beatty, and Bellinger can play 1B. So, to say the Dodgers have no one who can play 1B consistently is misguided. I think we all saw Bellinger play GG caliber defense there for a couple of years. Pujols wasn’t a need. I think most of us had any idea that AF would sign Pujols. Just like we don’t know what AF will do at the trade deadline if injuries are still an issue.
               Bottom line is you don’t have any idea what the Dodgers are going to do or how they are going to do it.
               Carry on

            2. The relief corps as it’s currently constructed and deployed does not match up well against the competitors the Dodgers would likely face in the playoffs and the World Series – namely the Padres, Red Sox, Yankees or Rays. The Dodgers would most likely lose a seven game series against any of those opponents.

               If you want to give experience to AAA players, that’s nice, but if you want to beat those teams and win a World Series, you shouldn’t be playing AAA players in the playoffs. Pujols should also not be getting significant playing time in the playoffs and WS if the objective is to win another one.

   3. Doc & Kersh both smiled when he pulled him. Seemed different than usual since Kersh almost always wants to keep going. You might be onto something about having Kelly pitch to Altuve. As a reminder NO ONE has forgotten & VERY FEW have forgiven their “sins”.
      Cheers

   4. It’s all about the arm and load management.

      There’s a science and a ton of data interpretations on it.

      I also think Kershaw mentioned that he was OK with it, so Roberts and he had probably discussed?

3. I think the Kershaw thing was to be cheered on by the fans, in that rat stadium!
   How many times have you seen a pitcher from the opposing team get cheered on in your own stadium?
   I am sure that no pitcher from Houston will EVER be cheered on in another stadium, EVER !!

   1. Yeah, I agree with you. It was nice to see Kersh get that standing O

4. Pujols with a nice at-bat.

   At keast he’s a bench guy in the playoffs.

   1. He just missed a big hit.

      1. I think that was the first time as a Dodger I actually saw him turn on a pitch and barrel it.

5. There has been much talk that most pitchers are using some kind substance(s) that helps them with spin rate. I don’t believe it has been discussed much here. With the continued downward trend in hitting and questions on what to do to improve offensive production I find difficult to understand why baseball has not attacked this aspect of the game. Oh wait, I forgot Boob Manfred is the commissioner. He’s more concerned with oversized bases, moving the pitchers mound back to 70 feet, and other misguided ideas that would come from a guy who never played baseball. To me banning these substances should be enforced immediately. Under Manfred we had the Houston cheating scandal along with other abuses of the rules. Now add in this disregard of the rules by pitchers. The rules are the rules! They should be enforced or eliminate them. It’s a reflection of today’s society. Congress and other local government bodies make laws which they themselves don’t enforce or follow. A congresswoman from the LA area, Maxine Waters, continually states “I don’t care what the law is”. Yet she helped made the laws. Manfred needs to enforce the rules or why have them. So far he has failed miserably to do so. He is baseball’s worst enemy right now.

   Pitchers have a huge advantage to begin with. They are successful getting hitters out at a rate of 70-75%. Now they are throwing harder than ever. They are using breaking pitches at a higher rate than ever. With all that they still feel it’s necessary to use a substance to have even a further advantage. It’s bullshit. Last night the Dodgers scored 9 runs on 7 hits along with 9 BB. Only two runs were the result of a homerun. Bottom line is that there wasn’t a lot of offensive action. As a longtime baseball and Dodger fan even I’m finding the games hard to watch. So, what is the casual fan think of how baseball is deteriorating into an unwatchable sport? We already know how Boob Manfred feels. He really doesn’t give a damn.
   Carry on

   1. It has been discussed.

      There’s a lot of coverage in the Athletic with the subtext that everybody knows it’s happening, it’s happening more and more, and a tipping point is within sight.

6. * Players all (try) get good at controlling what they can control and leave the rest to fate. So let’s go back to spring when Lux was projected to get the extended opportunity to make it or not at 2nd. There was a group that thought he should have been sent down or traded, or whatever and CT3 should have been the everyday guy at 2nd. When Seager got hurt it would have been easy to move CT3 to short, who’s had quality major league time there, leaving Lux at 2nd. Everyone now would be waiting for Seager to come back from his injury and back to short when he got healthy and Lux would be at 2nd, or not. But the decision was made to move Lux to short with no MLB experience there, just nice stats in AAA Instead, Lux has looked great at short and now the conversations have shifted to what to do with Seager? Some willing to ship him down the road now or let him walk later. Things chance rapidly in this business. Every player knows how fate can influence their career. One simple decision sort of changed the directions of 3 players.
   * CK has had 11 starts and they are taking a very conservative approach with pitch counts. He has exceeded 100 pitches only once and his last 2 starts have been 83 and 81 pitches, both wins. Doc is saving bullets.
   So someone please explain to me about last night and the management of CK. I obviously don’t have some secret information that’s available only to Doc.
   First, I think a long inactive delay between innings can be more damaging to a pitcher than the pitch count. I fully expected CK to have his night done after we scored 3 in the 7th. But Doc sent CK out for the 8th with a 7 run lead, after a 35 minute rest in the dugout, to throw 5 pitches. He got 2 outs on 81 pitches and looked fine. Than Doc pops out and makes the change.
   I don’t get that one. I personally would have replaced him to start the inning. Or let him pitch and finish the inning. But making the pitching switch gave us the opportunity to watch Doc manage or perhaps have Kelly face Altuve? Either way, that one has me scratching my old bald head.
   * If you’re around my age, I bet you remember the Walt Disney “Goofy” character. If you recall there was one cartoon where there was a “Good Goofy” v “Bad Goofy. Each appeared on opposite shoulders and advised Goofy on his behavior.
   I have that happening with the Astros. As a responsible senior I have matured and gained acceptance over their cheating behavior and have moved on letting bygones be bygones. That’s “Good Phil” there on my shoulder. But then there’s “Bad Phil” on the other shoulder whispering “I hate those cheating sons a bitches will never get over it. Hinch and Cora deserved lifetime suspensions and the players got off. I can never forgive that”. Right now Bad Phil continues to dominate.

   1. “As a responsible senior I have matured and gained acceptance over their cheating behavior and have moved on letting bygones be bygones. ”

      NO!

      Nice sentiment, but this is how bad behavior is allowed to flourish – when good people are too willing to let bygones be bygones. Manfred is banking on sentiment such as yours. It is a cynical calculation that if baseball makes a token attempt to apply marginal punishment and follow it up with press releases about how the problem is solved, we plebians will just accept it an continue to pay for our MLB.com streaming service and buy jerseys.

      They want this all swept under the rug so they can continue to make money without any ripples or without making any hard choices that would anger the owners or the MLBPA. Manfred is managing the business of baseball with little consideration or respect for its integrity or history.

      It is up to us fans to keep the keep the pressure on and keep the anger up and not let powerful, incompetent, feckless and cynical people off the hook.

      1. dodgerpatch I totally agreed with you on your view of the Houston debacle by Boob Manfred. I watch Altuvie, Bergman, and especially Correa and it makes me sick to my stomach. That leads me to thinking about how awful Manfred handled the whole mess. I don’t hate anyone, but Manfred is standing right at the line into hatehood with one foot in the air ready to take the step. And the smugness that the players had after being caught cheating and trying to justify their championship is pathetic at best. I will NEVER forgive those players and Manfred….. EVER. Whenever there is a question about why something happened it’s always about the Benjamins.

   2. It would be a lot easier to let bygones be bygones if MLB’s commissioner had the balls to do the right thing and take away that banner.

      Pete Rose has a lifetime ban for betting on baseball, with the assumption that he may have cheated to achieve the desired outcome, a loss for his team to cover a bet. The Black Sox also accused of cheating by throwing games and several players, including one of the games greatest “Shoeless Joe Jackson” receiving lifetime bans.

      The precedent was set.

      The Astros were proven to be cheaters, a couple of one year suspensions for management and upper management and no lifetime bans and they get to keep their flag, trophies and rings. That is a total bullshit outcome imposed by the worst and weakest commissioner in the history of the sport. Instead, focusing on rule changes and nets to “protect” fans from balls hit into the stands.

      Do you think we would be dealing with pitchers and pine tar right now if Manfred came down hard on the Astros?

      I think the fans should be relentless until that banner is removed and don’t stop until that happens. I will not forgive and forget and let bygones be bygones until that banner is removed.

   3. Wrong, “bad Phil” is “good Phil” and vice versa.

7. Heading home tomorrow. Nice win, proved they can’t hit Kersh when they do not know what is coming. Nice effort by the offense. 9 walks helped. I do not worry about pitchers coming in during a blow out..and to his credit, Bickford finished them off without too much trouble. And we all know this is not the 26 they will be going into the playoffs with.

   1. We would likely have had WAAAY more hits. but how can you hit a ball when they don’t throw strikes? Some of the worst pitching I have seen from multiple pitchers in a row in memory. Their relief just plain sucked.

8. As soon as Tony Gonsolin is back, the bullpen will be stronger. In fact, if the payoff started June 5th, this would likely be the Dodgers pitchers:

   Starters:
   1. Bauer
   2. Kershaw
   3. Buehler
   4. Bauer
   5. Kershaw
   6. Buehler
   7. All Hands

   Bullpen:
   1. Urias
   2. Gonsolin
   3. Price
   4. Treinen
   5. Kelly
   6. Jansen

   Next, pick who is healthy and run with it.

   Several are Multi-Innings Guys.

   1. Jones, Vesia, Cleavinger, Kahnle, Knebel, Nelson might all turn out to be lights out by the time the real playoffs start. I’m not too concerned with the upcoming imaginary playoff schedule.

   2. Let Urias start.

9. In doing a rewatch of the players reaction vid you posted, I found it quite interesting that Kiki had so much to say, and then he later said it was Cora who convinced him to go to Boston. I guess money really does talk.

10. Can’t wait to get people healthy and send all these AAA guys back to OKC. The Mendoza line is a reach for them!

11. AAA players in the lineup and the bullpen too.

12. Stupid move starting Bauer after 126 pitches against SF. He clearly did not have it tonight with his control and should been pitching tomorrow night in LA against SF with an extra day of rest. A bullpen game was in order tonight. If this usage continues they’re going blow out our starters. Gonsolin is very important to the team right now.

13. 30-19. Not bad considering everything that’s happened. Stay positive Dodger fans!

14. Agree with AVF,
    Beating the Cheaters is nice but beating the Midgets is more important. Someone needs to be making wise decisions in using the rotation and BP.

15. I understand both protecting/developing young arms and maximizing service time. But these bullpen days are not only a burden day of, but also day before.

    Gonsolin cant get stretched and promoted soon enough

Comments are closed.