I am of the opinion that most of us know nothing about building a bullpen. Garret Cleavinger was a pitcher most of you wanted to go bye-bye. He has had up and downs, but I see his stuff plays up to major league hitters. Last night, he pitches a 1-2-3 inning in the eighth, including two strikeouts. He is learning to trust his stuff… and that is how a bullpen is built, ladies and gentlemen! It is a pitcher at a time. I have been high on Cleavinger for a while but many of you wanted to throw him out with the bathwater. Do you really understand “bullpen building?”
You love instant coffee and “instant bullpen.” Cool! But it doesn’t happen like that.. and BTW instant coffee sucks. Building anything is a very difficult thing and most importantly, it is a process. Progress is not linear, but Cleavinger’s stuff last night was excellent/
I am so happy for Gavin Lux. That was a great 3-run HR for him. It won the game. He needs to experience some
Kenley Jansen is still the closer. He struck out 2 in the 9th inning and has a 1.76 ERA as he got his 6th save. i think that last night’s game was a “shut the hell up game”. The Boys in Blue are tired of all the talk. Is it a coincidence that the Dodgers took only 2 walks last night while getting 9 hits?
This bullpen is still in the process of being built. Patience, Grasshoppers
Dodgers Minor League Report
- OKC (1-5) lost again to the Round Rock Express 10-2. Ruiz was 3-5 with two doubles and Reks was 2-4, but that was it. Mosley, Cuello, and Uceta were cannon fodder.
- The Tulsa Drillers (2-5) were beaten by the Northwest Arkansas Naturals 5-1. Their only run came on a Mike Busch HR. Jacob Amaya was 2-4 and everyone else took the night off.
- The Great Lakes Loons (2-5) bet the West Michigan Whitecaps 9-1. Leonel Valera (SS) was 4-6 and James Outman was 2-6. Zac Ching hit a 3-run HR, and Clayton Beeter pitched a scoreless inning. Jeff Belge and Jack Little each pitched 3 scoreless innings.
- Rancho Cucamonga (4-2) beat Modesto 6-2. Jake Vogel and Sam McWilliams both had two hits as McWilliams also had 4 RBI on a 3-run HR.
No kidding. Cleavinger is has great stuff. I’ve said many times that he reminds me of Tony Cingrani. He’s going to be wild in and out of the zone until he harnesses that nastiness, but there’s a ton of potential there. It’s like the naysayers on this site don’t watch the games, instead they shuffle through the box score and decide if a player is good or not, which brings us to Gavin Lux.
I’m so happy he got his first homer this year out of the way. That should build some confidence. He’s looking like a defensive wiz at second base, he’s very fast and really looks like the most athletic guy on the field. But, after a slow start and only 248 career plate appearances spread out over three years people think he’s a bust.
Hey Watford, I think you’re on to something about Kris Bryant. I only preached about him all aff-season. I can’t see the Dodgers going after him this year though. He won’t be cheap and he won’t be available any time soon.
Nice game last night. A come from behind win. Bueller goes seven and hands it over to a horrible pen that finished the game facing the minimum 6 batters while striking out 4 of them. I sure would like to see more of that!
Who are we going to complain about today? Bueller giving up 4 on 3 bombs, does he suck now? Mookie and Turner going 1 for 8 combined?
Mike Busch: starting 2b for LA in 2022.
I wouldn’t bet against seeing him this year. Fun fact, he’s about 2 weeks older than Gavin Lux.
But why tear down a bullpen that helped win a championship? Why remove three affordable relievers who performed well in 2020?
If it ain’t broke…
I’m mostly puzzled that McGee, a power southpaw, was allowed to walk. A personality issue? For some reason he wore out his welcome in Colorado and the Dodgers lucked into him. He performed well here, piling up the Ks. Maybe Friedman thinks Zaidi overpaid for him but I think McGee is making less than half of what Friedman is paying Treinen.
I was less troubled by the trades of Floro and Kolarek, because prospects like Neuse and Vesia might work out. Still, these are veterans who proved they can do the job.
I can’t recall the chronology precisely–and it may not matter–but Friedman wanted to make room for Knebel and Nelson–and Kahnle later this year–and he realized he had the surplus of SPs as well. Some baseball pundit suggested that Floro and Kolarek probably wouldn’t make the Dodgers 26-man roster anyway so the trades were smart. But some of those one-run losses might be one-run wins if Floro was still around.
It was nice to see Cleavinger, another lefty, come through. And even more so Lux. Success from him would solve a variety of problems.
I thought it was curious that they didn’t bring back McGee has well, but he’s a 1 pitch pitcher and a lefty with reverse splits. He has a 4.50 ERA this year, so there’s that. I really thought Floro was coming into his own. He might have been out of options and they probably thought he wasn’t one of the best bullpen options unable to justify keeping him on the roster all year. Kolarek is really bad against righties, the three batter rule really messed up his usefulness.
Since we’re tossing out opinions, does anybody really know how to build a bullpen? No formula I’ve seen. Andrew Friedman likes different looks, pitches and angles. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t. So it really boils down to a pitcher or two coming out of the minors, a free agent signing, a flyer, maybe a trade in July or a starter or two joining the pen. Adapt and adjust. Friedman does that well. So the bullpen is really an evolutionary process.
Clevinger is an interesting bullpen piece. Tony Cingrani is a good comparison.
Big hit for Gavin Lux. He needed that. The Dodgers needed that. First win for LA when trailing after seven.
I can see people are already looking ahead to 2022. Will the Dodgers sign Corey Seager? What about Michael Busch at second? Gavin Lux at short? Expensive and not so expensive solutions available. How does the DH play into all this. Turner’s role? Kris Bryant?
Back to 2021. Will the Dodgers turn the corner with Lux blast? Will Cody Bellinger catch fire when he returns. Does Mookie Betts explode and impact each and every game? Are the Giants for real or will they fade in June? What about the Padres? Three horse race to the finish line?
IMO, the best way to build a bullpen is to start with the back end. The perfect bullpen has a lockdown closer, and a lefty and righty setup guy capable of pitching at the back end of games. Then you need a second lefty and a long man. Round that out with 3 more guys with options so you can send people back and forth from AAA. I’m less concerned with different looks, I want mostly gas, and a couple of sinkerballers that can get ground balls. Most of the guys should be home grown, then augment them with trades and free agents. I’m not as concerned with different arm angles, but you have to guys with different pitch mixes to attack guys with their kryptonite like a changeup for Arrozarena.
Best case scenerio for 2022 is that the Dodgers keep Seager and he eventually moves to 3B or 1B after Turner and Muncy’s contracts expire giving them time to develop Busch and Hoese as both are keepers. Future infield will be Seager and Hoese at the corners with Lux at SS and Busch at 2B unless one of them turn into an outfielder, but I can also see Seager settling down at SS and remaining there for the foreseeable future. If the DH comes next year, Justin takes that spot and hangs up his glove. Hopefully, Lindor sucking and Seager’s bad start is enough to scare other teams from offering Seager the keys to the city.
Bellinger will spark the offense when he returns, just because it makes the lineup that much longer. But, more importantly, he will solidify the defense. Even if he’s rusty, you still have to respect him in the lineup. Lux is going to figure it out and will set the plate for Mookie, who will catch fire once his ailments start to heal. Then, we will start to see the real Mookie Betts again instead of the imposter that’s been batting leadoff recently.
The Giants are trash. Belt, Posey and Crawford are all on pace for 40 homers and Alex Wood is their best pitcher so far. It’s all smoke and mirrors, this isn’t going to last. It’s a two horse town in the West and in the end, the Padres are still our little red headed step child.
Well thought out response. I agree.
If they haven’t built a huge lead when we’ve been playing this crappy, they never will. That goes for both teams. I’m feeling extra punch after the come from behind win last night. đ
Good response. I think, though, that AF is pretty enamored with having a bullpen with different looks. It makes intuitive sense if you go by Sabreball. That’s why you pull the starter before the opposing team sees him for the third time – they have two chances to figure out his sequencing and “learn” him. A bullpen with different but complementary looks, in theory, will keep the opposing lineup off balance. A few years ago, I think AF’s MO was just collecting a bunch of guys who threw high gas. High gas was the thing. But hitters adapt. Now it’s going with different looks and variability.
Sounds nice in theory, but if the perfect bullpen of idiosyncratic pitchers has guys who don’t perform or get injured, it kind of screws up the plan. I think AF, if he can be criticized, is that he gets too cute with all this stuff.
i am STILL getting really twisted about called balls/strikes this year. the 3rd strike call on betts in the 7th was criminal. still pining for roboumps myself. umps SHOULD BE the arbiters of the game being played to the rules set down, they are too much a part of the actual outcome these days, regardless of the win. there is a defined 3d strike zone & pitches in it should be strikes & vice versa for balls. the more movement a pitcher has on his stuff, the worse the umps are. i think treinen is an example of that for a pitcher who has A LOT of strikes called balls. anyway, nice win last night for sure.
cheers
Umpires this season more inconsistent than ever. Some of these strike calls defy description.
I donât know if this is a stat but we would lead the league in percentage of runs by home runs by our starters. They have pitched well but the home run bug has hit all of them. I thought Buehler pitched really well last night and had his good stuff. But two middle middle spinners to Seager and Haniger kind of spoiled his outing. I didnât think the first Haniger hr was a bad pitch, he just made a good swing on an elevated fastball.
Has anyone seen any articles if Dustin May had TJ surgery yesterday and how it went?
It was scheduled for yesterday. I’m assuming that something will be released today or tomorrow.
Guilty….. I called for them to dump Cleavinger. But one clean inning does not a resume make. I want to see him repeat that in more high leverage situations before I christen him a solid BP piece. Neuse is one of those who could benefit from regular playing time at AAA. He has some tools, but other than a couple of AB’s where he looked like a hitter, he has not looked like much lately.
The fact that Cleavinger pitched well last night doesn’t mean that he belongs on the Dodgers on the major league roster, especially pitching in a high leverage (down by 1 in the 8th) situation.
His minor league BB/9
2015 – 6.5
2016 – 4.0
2017 – 5.3
2018 – 8.1
2019 – 5.9
So far this year? 3 BB in 5.3 innings.
The majors isn’t the best place to learn how to throw strikes.
Padres lost 4 players to Covid protocols. Tatis, is one of them. Yanks have 2 coaches who tested positive. So in that sense LA has been pretty lucky so far. But we need our injured back ASAP,
My thoughts on Cleavinger…
First, some background. He was a third round pick by the Orioles, so there’s some pedigree. Yes, he has a lot of walks and a lot of K’s in his minor league career. Hits aren’t too bad and HR’s are not bad. His biggest problem is with the walks. He has a whopping 6.0 innings of MLB experience, all of it coming this year with the Dodgers except for the .2 innings with the Phillies last year. He is a rookie.
Now, look at the usage for this rookie.
Game 1 – Enters in the 11th of a tied game with a runner on second. A walk, a K and a couple of fly balls and takes the loss on a sac fly.
Game 2 – Enters in the ninth, 2 hits, 2 ground balls, a fly ball and no runs.
Game 3 – Rushed into the game after Dustin’s injury with a man on first. Finishes that inning after two walks and a single and a fly ball. Next inning Popup, K, HR, K.
Game 4 – Enters in Ninth (extra inning) with a man on second. Groundout moves the runner up. Gives up a single and takes the walk-off loss.
Game 5 – Enters in the 11th, the day after the walkoff with a man on second. K, K Single to score the tying run. A walk and a ground ball single beating the shift for another walkoff.
Game 6 – Enters the game with a 6 runs lead to relieve Mitch White after White allows 4 runs in the inning. Two runners on – Home run and K.
Game 7 was last night.
That’s how you start off a rookie reliever? Pretty much every time they used him this year was in a high leverage situation. Usually, a rookie reliever would be permitted to work up to those situations. Trial by fire is probably not the best way to bring up a rookie reliever.
So yes, the Majors isn’t the best place to learn how to throw strikes. But if you want to make the situation even worse, find the worst situations to put him in and expect him to throw strikes. And don’t blame the manger because he’s good in the clubhouse and the players love him.
He’s a Duck so he’s dope.
Dodgers Prospect Josiah Gray Scratched From Oklahoma City Start Due To Potential Injury
The Los Angeles Dodgers have dealt with a slew of injuries to their Major League roster and now may have another on their hands with top pitching prospect Josiah Gray, who was a late scratch from his start for Triple-A Oklahoma City on Tuesday night.
Gray began his warmup routine in the outfield and there wasnât any clear indication of trouble. âObviously when a starter, certainly a top prospect is scratched from a start, weâve got to do some testing,â Dodgers manager Dave Roberts said. âAnd I donât know if weâve done that yet.â
The outing was due to be Grayâs second of the season for OKC. He went five innings on Opening Day of the Triple-A campaign and set a career high with 10 strikeouts.
Roberts recently ruled out Gray as an option to be recalled for his MLB debut, but indicated Tuesday night there had been a bit of a reversal. âThere was some talk,â Roberts said. âWe were talking about it potentially, but weâre going to have to kind of shelve that for a little bit.â
Josiah Gray Was Being Considered for a Call Up Before Being Scratched
The Dodgers were looking at adding Gray in before a possible injury.
by Brook Smith
*So happy for Lux and the Dodgers. We finally got a big hit for a walk-off.
* Mookie AB bottom 7 was a microcosm of the year. Has he pissed off the Umpires Union or something? He gets more bad strike calls. His10 pitch AB had him grinding for life was great. Finally he takes Ball 4, FOR STRIKE 3. Itâs unbelievable.
(One small note so I can tell Mookie how to hit – never check swing on strike 1, ever. Especially with the bases juiced. A check swing tapper back to the pitcher is an ultimate buzz killer)
*The philosophy of taking pitches doesnât work with bad umpires.
Ask Muncy. He f bombed his way to the dugout after taking borderline strike 2 and whiffing on a tough strike 3. He was pissed at the strike 2 call but the reality was that he took a 2 & 0 cockshot for strike 1. Hit that pitch! It was the best pitch he saw in the AB..
Not a great performance by the O last night but a great outcome.
roboumps. ball/strike calling is the WORST i have ever seen it. both ways. we would have a MUCH BETTER game if pitchers & batters both actually knew where the strike zone ALWAYS IS. those “purists” who say that takes away from catcher framing etc. are off base. who ever SAID “framing” should be part of the game & that everyone has to figure out where the strike zone is that particular day? it is a ridiculous argument. there is a defined 3d area that is the strike zone. and tech exists right now to fix this. mlb is dragging their feet on this, much to their detriment. hell, that called 3rd strike against mookie cost us a run so in essence if we had lost by one run, it would have been a game DECIDED by an ump’s bad call.
cheers
Dustin May surgery-
AVF and BandP were discussing this yesterday and wondering if it had been done on schedule.
Just saw a tweet from May with him in a hospital bed, a smile on his face and his arm in a sling. I think we can assume the surgery was done and so far so good judging by his expression.
https://twitter.com/d_maydabeast/status/1392553855288631297/photo/1
This situation reminds me of one of my mentors. Every business, especially early on, runs into cash flow issues. His advise:
âYou canât analyze your way out of a cash flow problem. You just have to grind. Everyday. One deposit and one bill at a time.â
I think we are all over analyzing this. The Dodgers need to get into grind mode. That simple. One base runner. One hit. One inning at a time. Grind it out. This isnât a problem that will be solved with macro analysis. They just got to get back to basics.
Gray being shut down for 7-10 days with a shoulder impingement. That doesn’t sound terribly encouraging.
I wonder if Burt Hooton would consider coming out of retirement?
Mark Prior is already here. Have him put on a glove, get on the bump, and see if anyone notices.
And yet another bad break for the Dodgers pitching situation.
Never a good sign if a young guy has to be shut down with shoulder issues. Julio comes to mind immediately.
Go Dodgers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now we know that Rios really was injured. He is out for the season with a torn Labrum and having surgery.
Time for those of us who were on his case to retroactively cut him some slack. That would certainly explain his loss of power and his overall inability to hit this year.
Are you freaking kidding me? SMH
Too bad about Rios. Next year I hope we see the real Edwin. Umps this season have been pitiful
It’s his right shoulder so not only will it affect his throwing, it will also mess up his follow through on his swing. You might remember that Matt Kemp tore his left labrum and his follow through on his swing was never the same.
I haven’t seen the medicals, but no one knew about Rios’ injury. Everyone knew about Matt’s injury, it was bad and everyone that saw the play could see that. He ran full speed into the wall and the wall didn’t budge at all, with the shoulder taking all of the load. Matt had a torn labrum and damage to the rotator cuff. Rios’s injury is a partially torn labrum. Sounds to me like Matt’s was different and worse, but I’m not a Doctor.
On the bright side, it will eventually open a roster spot when they put him on the 60 day? More Beaty and Nuese?
Here’s an old article regarding Matt’s injury…
https://thinkbluela.com/2013/05/what-arent-they-telling-us-about-matt-kemp/
It makes me wonder who let Rios play with that bad of an injury and why did they let him play.
The Dodgers could use a veteran pinch-hitter at the trade deadline along with at least two relievers maybe three. I would hate to know who we would have to give up for all of that.
Yes, Dodgers need a vet pinch hitter like Utley or Freese in years back. Bryant would be huge because he not only gives you the big bat but he could spell JT at 3b or slide into LF.
I am pretty sure AF and DR hope that they will get Graterol, Kahnle and Ferguson back for the stretch run and possible postseason play. That would make our pen loaded with huge, huge arms.
They will monitor the rehab of those three pitchers very closely and that will determine if and how many arms they go after at the deadline.
Go Dodgers””””””””””””””
From Internet:
Kevin Goldstein chat:
TT: I know youâre not a big Keibert Ruiz fan, but isnât it about time we âfree Keibert Ruiz!â ?
Kevin Goldstein: To what end? To sit on the bench and watch Will Smith?
Dan Szymborski says: No, We Don’t Need to Worry About the Dodgers
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/no-we-dont-need-to-worry-about-the-dodgers/
Andy Pages has a relatively good arm:
https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1392297324542513155/pu/vid/960×444/TARX44VhJvH0iRs2.mp4?tag=12
The mechanics of prospect Andre Jackson and ace Walker Beuhler are oddly similar:
https://video.twimg.com/tweet_video/E1Ka4dgUYAQgC2s.mp4
Emily Waldon on Clayton Beeter:
#Dodgers 2020 CBB pick Clayton Beeter has 12 pitches (six for strikes) through his first frame with a walk and a strikeout. Sturdy 6’2, 220 lbs. Nice 3/4 slot with composed low pitch count to start the night. FB, CV, SL, CH. FB/SL combo is really attractive.
Dodger’s prospect Bobby Miller has future ace written all over him:
https://www.mlive.com/sports/saginaw-bay-city/2021/05/dodgers-prospect-bobby-miller-has-future-ace-written-all-over-him.html
For that guy who posts here and hates the Padres, here are their top 39 prospects via Longenhagen:
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/top-39-prospects-san-diego-padres/
For that guy who has an irrational (IMO) dislike of the NY Times, here’s that excellent article on masks:
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/11/briefing/outdoor-covid-transmission-cdc-number.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage
The great Kiley McDaniel has his first mock draft:
https://www.espn.com/mlb/insider/story/_/id/31422161/kiley-mcdaniel-2021-mlb-mock-draft-10-pirates-tough-choice-make-no-1-overall-pick
Ben Kudrna, RHP, Blue Valley Southwest H.S. (KS), LSU commit
Kudrna fits in the Dodgers mold of power arms, and they’ve been tied mostly to prep players, which makes sense given their top-tier development.
Eric, is Jimmy Nelson growing on you
Beaty could be a regular with more playing time.
They ground it out tonight.
Donât overanalyze.
I say this as a statistician.
Good game.
Another promising performance all round.
I think we probably already needed that veteran bench piece before the season started Eric. Always looked a little short to me.
Nelson definitely looking more comfortable now, although I might have rolled Kelly out there with a 6 run lead, to give him a confidence booster.
Anyway, things are looking better.