What if Clayton Kershaw had gotten Soto and Rendon out as easily as he did Eaton?
What if Joe Kelly was lights out in the second inning he pitched?
It’s easy to blame Doc, but if Clayton had executed… and it’s not out of the question that he could have, Dave Roberts (actually… Clayton Kershaw) would have been the hero. I don’t like the results, but the players did not execute. Blame it on whoever you want, but I blame the players.
If anything, blame it on Andrew Friedman for not giving Doc better options, but you only have to look at the Nationals to realize the way they played during the regular season was not the way they played in the playoffs and the options they had were much less viable than the Dodgers possessed.
The Dodgers and the Nats both had 4.20 ERA’s in the Division Series. The difference was what happened in crunch time. Kershaw imploded and so did Kelly. Of course, Dave Roberts is the one who gets blamed. You can blame Aaron Boone and AJ Hinch and Mike Shildt too, The manager is easy to blame. It’s simple. It’s easy and it gives fans a “whipping boy.”
What if in the 1988 World Series, Tommy Lasorda brought in Kirk Gibson and he grounded out weakly to the SS? It was Kirk Gibson who delivered, but had he not, Tommy would have been the goat! “Why bring up a guy to hit who can’t even walk?”
You can blame Doc… maybe it makes you feel better to blame someone in control… especially if you are not in control of your life. Hell, you can blame Andrew Friedman, but I will say this just once: A team good enough to win 106 games is good enough to win the World Series! Russ Martin and David Freese hit .500 in the playoffs. Kike Hernandez hit .429 and Matt Beaty hit .375. Turner, Pederson, and Lux were good, but Cody Bellinger and Corey Seager, who should have been the team’s best hitters simply disappeared!
Kirk Gibson and Orel Hershiser found a way. Clayton, Corey, and Cody did not! It’s as simple as that. Gibby was focused only on the “backdoor slider” and that is what he got. Was it luck or skill? You decide… but he found a way and it broke the A’s spirit.
The Yankees just made it known that they will do whatever is necessary to sign Gerrit Cole. AF should bid it up and let them sign him for dope-fiend money. The 2020 Dodgers as they stand are capable of getting to the World Series and if they get there, then they are capable of winning it. This is not fantasy baseball. This is the real deal where humans step up or fail.
Here’s a question: Will Gerrit Cole be Justin Verlander or Jake Arrietta going forward? Wheeler has had Tommy John Surgery… Cole has not. Will Cole keep going down that road or will the workload the past two years take a toll. I don’t know and neither do you… and neither does any GM. It’s a risk. It’s a risk with Strasburg. He’s had TJ -it’s rare to have it again, but an ortho doc once said “there are two types of pitchers: those who have had TJ and those that will.” Of course, that is not ALWAYS true, but it’s true a lot.
You want Aaron Bummer, but what if he is like Blake Treinen? Great one year… not so great the next. Most of you look at the stats from last year and pick the guys you want, but you might be better picking the guys who had bad years. Trade Joe Kelly and AJ Pollock? That is what a fool would try and do (they would find no takers), but next year both could be co-MVPs in the World Series. Disclaimer: I am not saying that will happen… just that it could.
When you are dealing with a reliever, the odds are less than 50-50 he will be the guy he was last year, next year! You have no idea! Andrew Friedman has an idea – he probably assigns a statistical probability to each reliever. We all know that there are few exceptions of relievers who are good, year-in-and-year-out, but we still want AF to “fix” the Dodger bullpen. Quite frequently, the player you trade for is better than the player you get.
It’s not that Andrew Friedman doesn’t value relievers. He just doesn’t overvalue them. Blake Treinen was pretty bad last year, but he is in line to get a substantial 3-year deal according to what I hear. I would have to think long and hard about that. Most baseball fans, if they were buying stock, would buy at the top and sell at the bottom. But, successful investors buy when it’s at the bottom and sell at the top. Past performance is no guarantee of future prospects.
I like the Dodgers Farm System right about now. They have 5 Top 100 prospects… only a couple of teams have 6. The farm delivered 7 rookies to the majors last year… and they won 106 games! I’ll bet not many teams exceeded that number. Everyone wants Lindor, Kluber or Betts, but they are going to cost the Dodgers a number of prospects and players, like Lux, Ruiz, Verdugo, May, Gonsolin, Downs, Gray and Peters. Not all of those guys will be stars, but I like that group a lot and say NO to trades.
I think that if the Dodgers sign Donaldson or Rendon, the team will be much better. I still like Castellanos. Cole and/or Strasburg would be nice, but there are no guarantees that either one will be as good as they were in 2019. That is a fact. Maybe…. maybe not! Let me remind you that the oldest team, worst bullpen team, the team that was in a shambles early in the year, the team that no one picked, the team that lost their superstar, won the World Series because they got hot, got confident, and executed when they had to.
Davey Martinez was criticized all year for bad decisions, but just about every decision he made in the playoffs was right. When players execute, the manager becomes a genius, When they don’t he’s an idiot. It’s human nature to want to blame someone. In the 2017 World Series, Clayton pitched several innings out of the pen and pitched very well. The guy had a 3.00 ERA in 2019 – that’s better than Strasburg. When I hear people criticize Doc for bringing him in and leaving him in, I realize I am dealing with pure second-guessers who are thinking with their hearts and not their heads. Thet’s why Doc wasn’t fired. Doc made a decision and Clayton should have been able to execute. Maybe he will finally learn a changeup over the winter – if he does, he might pitch 6 more years. If he doesn’t he’s the #4 next year!
Maybe the Dodgers just make a few peripheral moves this offseason…. not a big splash. Maybe they are not even picked to win the division after other teams make some signings. That might be the best thing that has happened to them. Maybe they will play with a chip on their shoulder and be forced to execute…
Nats have said they can’t afford to sign both Strasburg and Rendon. So while we dream about a Cole/ Strasburg signing we could very well see Cole sign with the Yankees for dope fiend money andStrasburg resign with the Nats. It sounds like they will prioritize Strasburg as they are reportedly looking more at Donaldson.
As for execution, as I recall in game 5 of the NLDS. Bellinger was twice on second in the later innings and no one could drive him in. If he had scored the Dodgers win 4-3 and we not talking about any of this. Clutch hitting was a big problem. It’s why I don’t understand Verdugo bashing. Homers are great but I’ll take clutch hitting anytime. Verdugo with his bat to ball skills I think goes along way to meeting that objective.
This is a great article and a really good perspective.
While I agree with most of what you’re saying, Mark, the Dodgers do need to do something big. Just a sense, but it would seem all the stars are aligning. Payroll flexibility, star quality free agents available, depth on the MLB roster, top five farm system, fan expectation, LA sports teams are star driven, major stadium improvements, hosting the All-Star game and what they are currently doing hasn’t put them over the top.
Andrew Friedman even said something was missing. So, I think Ken Rosenthal’s column in the Athletic makes an excellent point, if not now, when? The Epstein comment holds true for the Dodgers.
Pretty much everyone believes the Dodgers need to do something big. It would be a massive shot in the arm for the team, the organization and the fan base.
There are no guarantees and these are incredibly expensive players we’re talking about. There is no perfect answer. The Dodgers could use another top of the rotation arm. They could use a long term solution (five, six years) at third base.
The Dodgers have money, nearly four million ticket sales and big time TV revenue. The TV revenue alone will cover a $200 million payroll. So why not go for it? Sign a big free agent, sign a FA (a couple that might make sense) reliever and trade for a relief pitcher or two.
Nice counter point. It feels like AF will do something big, just not sure what direction he goes (blockbuster trade or FA signing). I watched a piece on MLB network where they had four GM’s around a table talking about being a baseball executive, analytics and todays baseball.
Jed Hoyer was asked about the grade that sent Torres to the Yankees for Chapman and how Torres might be the next Mike Trout and how the Cubs playing, of late, has been bad. Basically, Brian Kenney was questioning Hoyer that the Cubs mortgaged the future for the present. Hoyer said the team recognized they were solid and had a WS winning roster with the exception of a quality closer and if they didn’t go for it all right then when would they go for it?
I think AF is somewhat in the same position. The Dodgers have a great collection of young talent and a great development team, but they don’t give meaningful awards for collection of talent. You’ve got to win it all!
They have a great roster, a great farm system, a soon-to-be new front door to DS, and an all-star game at DS for the first time since 1980 and a city that attracts big stars. The Lakers are relevant and championship driven again, the Rams have returned to LA and made it to the Super Bowl in year 3 with big stars, the Angels have baseball’s best player and while I agree with MT the Dodgers are indeed a talented group I think their chances of winning the Fall Classic are a lot better if we pair Buehler with another big arm like Cole or Strasburg or pair Bellinger with another superstar like Rendon. Seager, JT, Verdugo, CT3, Smith, Beaty, etc are all solid players, but they are not superstars.
The Dodgers need another superstar and I think we’ll soon find out where this goes. Lindor, Rendon, Cole or Strasburg? Get’ er done AF.
I agree. Adding a stud in the lineup takes pressure off others. As does adding an Ace to the rotation. At a minimum, I would be happy with Donaldson and Ryu. I’d rather have both of them, than one of Cole, Stras, or Rendon.
How about sign Donaldson and Ryu. Trade Muncy, Verdugo, Maeda, Joc for Giles and Betts?
Betts RF
Seager SS
Turner 1B
Belli CF
Donaldson 3B
Pollock LF
Lux 2B
Smith C
Bueller
Ryu
Kershaw
May
Urias
Giles
Kenley
Baez
Kelly
Alexander
Ferguson
Stripling
Gonsolin
The Ken Rosenthal article at The Athletic on the Dodgers is just great.
If you read just one piece of paid content today on the Dodgers that should be it.
I agree that a team which wins 106 games should be able to win the World Series. I would love to see them add a Rendon or a Cole/Strasburg, but what I really think is missing is the team leader with ATTITUDE.
JT is pretty much considered the position player leader of the team and he does a good job of that, but I think he’s too nice a guy to kick the other guys in their ass when they need it. I think this needs to come from a player, not the manager and I think it needs to come from a position player, someone on the field most every day. We need another Gibby-type. They say Donaldson is that type of guy. You can only do this if you’re one of the best producers on the team so if we sign him he needs to continue producing in order to be a leader. I’m sure there are other guys around MLB who are this type of leader. If not Donaldson, maybe AF can identify someone else to fill those shoes. I really think it’s our most important need right now.
So, we’re looking at the dumpster diving approach to building a bullpen. If we wind up with Gausman, Treinen and Crosby, is that enough to make a good pen? BTW, Crosby walked over 6 per 9 in Independent Ball.
Pitching staff reality. Kershaw, Bueller and Maeda are almost sure things for the rotation. Urias and May look ready to take over the other spots. Stripling is a solid swing man and Gonsolin and possibly Gray will be able to make some starts next season if anyone gets hurt. If we wind up with Cole or Stras, someone will need to be traded. Hey Kenta, do you want to be traded to the Blue Jays for Giles, or do you want to suck it up and become a backend bullpen piece?
Infield reality. Turner lost a step, or was his defense bad because of injuries? Probably a little bit of both. But, I have no problem with RedTurn2 at the hot corner for another year, especially with Rios and Beaty around to give him some time off. Seager is going to have a normal offseason and a full Spring Training for the first time in his career with the big club. I think this will be his best year. If Lux was on 90% of the other teams, he would already be penciled in at 2nd base. Hell, CT3 and Kike could both play 2B or CF on half of the teams out there. I’m not going to get into it with Muncy because everyone likes all those homers. He can play a solid 1B or mediocre 2B with a lot of homers, walks and strikeouts. But, Donaldson, Rendon and Lindor is possibly worth moving things around a bit.
Outfield reality. Belli – stud. Then you have Pollock, Verdugo and Joc for the rest of the outfield. I wouldn’t be opposed to splitting the playing time evenly among these three over 2 positions all year. One is always a great bat off the bench and it keeps Pollock healthy, Joc from hitting lefties and Verdugo from getting too cocky, if that’s possible. But, Betts is worth making room for.
So, in a sense, Mark is right that the team is good enough. But, is good enough a good strategy? I think not. There are opportunities to improve the team so you do it! This is the Friday before the Winter Meetings. The last thing I want to hear is to go dumpster diving for relief pitching and to stand pat and hug our prospects a little tighter when there’s no room for them anyway.
Again, if the Dodgers let just one different team outbid them for each player, they will never get a top free agent. That is just pure logic. The Yankees want to win titles. The Dodgers want to make the playoffs, bring 4 million fans in. Both will get their wish. I think it is appalling that the Dodgers continue to find ways and excuses not to come up with the best roster in baseball in at least some of the years. I do not see how “bidding it up and then making the Yankees spend more for Cole” does us one iota of good, unless the fans are investors in the Dodgers, and thus get to share in the profits, which of course they don’t.
The Dodgers did not have a team reasonably capable of winning the title last year, I don’t care how many regular season games they won. They had only one top starter by season’s end, no fourth starter, which you need in long series. They had no closer and no set-up man. And they didn’t have the great hitter who could drive in key runs with men on base. Yes, they could have managed to get by the Nationals, though they did not. They would never have gotten by the Astros, who had better starters and a better, albeit not great, bullpen, plus a better lineup. They didn’t come close to getting by the Red Sox the year before. They had one big chance, in 2017, and did not win. My guess is that if they continue on the path of making excuses for why they just couldn’t spend as much as the Yankees (Astros, Red Sox, Braves) on a key player, they will not even make a World Series in the next five seasons.
It’s their money, I guess, they are making record profits, adding new investors each year. This does not do the fans any good, not those who want to root for a franchise which wins titles., and is always out to do what it takes to win them. The Yankees spent money on Stanton, Lemahieu, and they still have enough to outbid the Dodgers for Cole? What the Yankees want, they usually get. What the Dodgers ownership wants, which is big profits and the ability to look like they are trying to win a title, while not really, they manage to achieve. This current Dodgers roster will not win a title. Our pitching staff is not good enough, and our bullpen is in need of a total rebuild. Send this roster out there, with a few minor patches, next season, and the fan base will be demoralized, the team will probably win the division for one more year, but not have the best record in the league, and will not get out of the NL playoffs. I can only speak for myself, but I am absolutely tired of hearing the Dodgers’ executives utter a bunch of vague cliches to cover the fact that their primary goal is to maximize their profits, not their on-field success.
Bluto’s right about Rosenthal’s article.
Here’s Friedman on courting free agents, per Rosenthal:
“Friedman entered last offseason saying his front office’s mindset was “to be aggressive, without reaching the point of stupidity.” The offer to Harper fit both descriptions, but a more widely circulated quote of Friedman’s from three years ago is perhaps more instructive.
“If you’re always rational about every free agent, you will finish third on every free agent,” Friedman said.”
So you can be rational and end up adding no additional talent, or you can go big to get the guy that you want.
Pedro Moura, also in The Athletic wrote this earlier today:
“I do not have the impression that the Dodgers are dramatically reconsidering their approach to assembling an organization, no. Friedman would tell you that he and his staff have been plenty aggressive in past years, and to at least some extent he is correct.”
ESPN.com reports that the Yankees and Angels might offer over $250MM over 7 years to Gerrit Cole. I don’t see Friedman ever doing that. The Dodgers will continue, in Friedman’s words, to finish 3rd on signing high end free agents.
As to Mark’s comments about execution, my response is that it’s easier said than done. There are some players who just don’t play well in the post-season, and some who do. Think about Don Newcombe for instance as a guy who couldn’t get it done in the Series, but may have been the best pitcher in the NL for about 7 years.
It’s not just execution – it’s having the players who execute. Thus far in their careers, Cody and Cory don’t execute; JT does. Kershaw and Jansen have been iffy; Buehler has stepped up. Put it this way – do you have the sense when Bellinger comes up with men on base in the post-season that he’ll probably strike out (again) or knock the baserunners in?
Over the past several years, the Dodgers have proven that they can win the regular season – not the post-season.
A lot of “what ifs”. If the Queen had balls she’d be king. The point is the players did NOT come through. Not all of us who complained about Kershaw coming back out in the 8th used hindsight. I was watching the game after Kershaw got Eaton and turned to my wife and said, Kershaw did his job. Now let’s see Maeda go after Rendon, Kolarek go at Soto, and then May face Kendrick. That would leave Jansen for the save in the 9th, facing 6, 7,and 8. I was sitting in my office, and that is what I thought should happen. And I know I was not the only one who thought that at the time.
So if the players continue to fail in the playoffs every year, then maybe AF does not have the right players. Or maybe it is just a single player. There is no Gibby, no Bulldog, no Reggie, no MadBum on this team. Who is? If I knew, I would be making $7MM doing the job I was born to do (okay maybe not so much). When you continue to shop for house spirits instead of top shelf, you might find a good make every once in a while, but you will undoubtedly more often than not be happier with top shelf. Yes the great buzz is only momentary, but it is great while it lasts. At least that is how I remember it since I rarely drink anymore.
What if Belli is really the 2018 version? What if Seager will never be able to come back fully after two surgeries? What if Kershaw’s back needs surgery? What if the season slump of Will Smith is really who he is? What if JT and AJ Pollock only play 80 games. What if Verdugo’s back becomes a chronic issue? What if Keibert Ruiz never realizes the level of success that Mark thinks he is capable of? What if Floro, Shaggy, and Sadler are nothing more than what they have always been…mediocre relievers. I can go on because It is easy to play what if when you are trying to form an argument to fit your point of view.
So yes, some of us look at last year’s numbers to see who has been successful. But that is not always the case. Aaron Bummer was not a heralded reliever after 2018, and when Joc was being a target of the ChiSox last year, I was all in on Aaron Bummer at the time. Not after his 2019 season, but before ST, and wrote about him often. But not only did AF want him, so did Rick Hahn. Thus he stayed a White Sox. In January 2017 when the Dodgers signed Brandon Morrow, I immediately hearkened back to what this former starting pitcher did as a reliever with San Diego at the end of 2016, and believed he was going to be the Dodgers setup man, and stated many times in 2017 ST. I knew that he would be recalled before June 1 because that was the date he needed to be on the roster, or he would become a FA. We all remember what he did in 2017.
I have certainly missed. I wrote as much about Jesen Therrien as I did about Brandon Morrow, and he obviously did not pan out. I loved Jose De Leon, and thought he would be a star. I think Drew Pomeranz is going to be the next in line with Andrew Miller, Brad Hand, and Brandon Morrow…former marginal to poor starting pitchers finding a home as a late inning high leverage reliever. Will he? I think so, but I agree, there are no guarantees. I have a couple of relievers that I am interested in following as I did with Bummer in 2019 and Ryan Pressly in 2018, and I will be writing about one of them this week.
Yes, Gerrit Cole may blow out his arm, or resemble Jake Arrieta more than Justin Verlander. But what if he doesn’t and he can become that two headed Ace with Buehler for the next several years. Or Strasburg. You continue to mention TJ surgery with Stras, but never play what if about Walker Buehler’s TJ repaired right elbow.
Blake Treinen is another former starter (primarily) who came up with Washington in a swing role (2014). He became a full time reliever in 2015. In 2016 he became legit, but when he started 2017 poorly with Washington, he was traded to Oakland in the Sean Doolittle deal. Treinen became dominant with Oakland in 2017 thru 2018 (and I mean dominant). He was hurt for most of 2019, and was never able to get on track. But I am going to side on the what if side he becomes dominant again. Treinen has done it, and it is more likely that he will rediscover what made him that way more than Dylan Floro or JT Chargois, or Casey Sadler, or Yimi Garcia ever getting to that level once. As I said earlier in the week, I am all in with experimenting with Blake Treinen or even Kevin Gausman. But it needs to be countered with a proven late inning reliever. Will Harris, Ken Giles, Jose Leclerc, Aaron Bummer, have all had success in that role. Will they for the Dodgers? Take a chance and find out.
I will say again, if you are afraid to pull the trigger to give your team a better chance, and feel more comfortable playing it safe, then go back to Tampa Bay or buddy up with Billy Beane or Derek Jeter. I am not trying to be critical of AF. I would not want any other baseball exec steering the course for LAD. But as good as he has been, he has never won the last game of the MLB season. His MO is to find the covered jewel but not sign a high priced difference maker FA. Maybe this year he needs to go out of his comfort zone and not play it safe. GO BOLD. Sign one of the top 3, whatever it takes. My preference is pitching, but I will be happy with Rendon. Trade for another front line player or pitcher and proven relievers. Shake the team up, and maybe the next Kirk Gibson or Orel Hershiser will be wearing Dodger Blue when they celebrate winning the WS in 2020 (and 2021).
I am all for the fact that players have to execute but the manager/coach also has to pt players in the right spots, or remove them, and recognize that it is, or is not, working and adapt from there.
You would not blame a 3rd string QB that was put into a game and expected to play like Lamar Jackson.
You would not blame Kike for not being able to get out of the 3rd if Roberts started HIM in a Game 4.
I don’t really blame Kershaw for the 2nd homer…………..or the first.
Kershaw get Eaton on 3 pitches. Looked great. The ball to Rendon was a good pitch. Rendon just beat him. THAT is where it had to end though (I also texted my friends that were group texting during the game after Eaton was out and said…..OK Kersh survived Eaton. lets get Maeda in there now and not tempt fate).
There is no way, no how that anyone can logically defend keeping Kershaw in to face Soto other than its LH on LH, and we had others who were better suited ready to go. Knowing Kershaw’s history and what his mind had to be going through after giving up the HR to Rendon, it is inexcusable that Roberts just left him in.
Standing there and watching Kelly load the bases is also beyond belief in a game 5. Nothing. Nada. Just watching with arms folded.
Putting guys up to produce is one thing. Putting the wrong guys up to produce and sitting on your hands while they don’t is a complete other thing.
Roberts failed. Plain and simple.
Hoping that guys get better and don’t do what they always have is not a strategy. It a prayer.
Going into 2020 with the current roster, there is not ONE bullpen asset that is reliable. There is ONE SP in Bueller. On the field, you have a lot of really good players but nobody that is great outside of Bellinger, and who knows if he produces like last year.
Not upgrading the team because you are afraid that things could go wrong is not the attitude the Dodgers should have. It is frustrating to hear year after year that we missed out on this person or that person but maybe….just maybe….this guy that we scraped of the trashheaps MAY be yet another good player. I am tired of good, and tired of the the praise that everyone on the team can play any position.
Get some guys that are studs at THEIR position and their role and produce.
AC you’re absolutely right! If Dodgers get passed Rendon and Soto it’s game over! You have to put your best against their best with the game on the line! That was Maeda against Rendon and then Kolarek against Soto. At least Roberts should have taken Kersh out after Rendon and put in Kolarek in against Soto who he owned up to that point. That was a huge blunder. I love Doc but that one is on him! You’ve got to be cutthroat in the playoffs not worried about players feelings!
Did Clayton produce after being left in? Did Kelly produce after left in to pitch another inning? No, they did not, but Roberts did not produce either, in my opinion, by making those moves. Regarding of those saying, he only had to use what arms he had available, I think he had other choices which he did not use. Sorry to sound so negative but Roberts needs to share a lot of this blame for the playoff results. That being said, we need to put this behind us eventually and move forward and correct the mistakes made last year, talking to you AF. Go Dodgers.
The Dodger players all believed they should have won the 2017 WS and were disgusted that they didn’t do better in the 2018 WS. They played with a mission throughout the 2019 season wanting to get rid of the taste of disappointment but anything can happen is a short series against a team with good pitching and it did; in a bad way for the Dodgers.
The Dodgers might need an added spark to grind through the 2020 season and for that reason alone, maybe one or more of the core might have to be traded to get a new spark. I think that guy is either Lindor or Betts or both. A thing to remember is that Betts can play the infield.
SS Lindor (Muncy, Downs, Taylor)
3B Seager
RF Betts (Verdugo, Gonsolin) — Save the Cole $$ to re-sign Betts
CF Bellinger
1B Turner — maybe Seager moves from 3rd to 1st in 2021
LF Pederson 70%, Hernandez 30%
C Smith and Barnes
2B Lux
Buehler
Kershaw
Kluber (Maeda, White, Beaty, Grove
Urias
Stripling or May
Jansen
Diaz (Baez, Pollock, $$)
Fergusson
etc.
Here’s Jim Bowden’s take:
Trade Francisco Lindor to the Dodgers in exchange for shortstop Gavin Lux, outfielder Joc Pederson and right-handed pitcher Ross Stripling. If the Indians aren’t going to extend Lindor this offseason, then the time to trade him is now if they want to keep contending after he departs. If the Tribe can get the Dodgers to include Lux, their top shortstop prospect, then they have to seriously consider making the unpopular trade. With the Dodgers’ depth, they might be able to pry outfielder Pederson (they’re not getting Alex Verdugo) and Stripling in a four-player trade.
Trade shortstop Gavin Lux, outfielder Joc Pederson and right-handed pitcher Ross Stripling to the Indians in exchange for Francisco Lindor. Lindor is one of the best overall players in baseball; he can hit for average and power and is an elite defender. He’s coming off a 4.7 WAR season with 32 home runs and an OPS+ of 118. Lindor has a Magic Johnson-caliber smile and would look great on LA billboards alongside Cody Bellinger. The price to get him would be steep, but worth it — especially since the Dodgers have the resources to sign him long-term. With these moves, the Dodgers could then move Corey Seager to second base. The Dodgers need to take advantage of their window to win a World Series and this trade would help significantly.
I would do that! Then sign Cole.
1. Lindor SS
2. Seager 3B
3. Bellinger CF
4. Muncy 2B
5. Turner 1B
6. Verdugo RF
7. Beaty/Hernandez LF or Rios or CT3
8. Smith
You already said you weren’t signing Cole because you won’t match the Yankees and Angels. Do you really like that mess in LF better than Pollock?
I would trade Lux in a package for Betts before I trade him for Lindor. Move Betts back to second, leave Muncy at 1B, Turner at 3B, Seager at SS. I don’t think it makes any sense for everyone to change positions to accommodate Lindor. Better yet, trade Ruiz and Muncy for Betts and keep Joc in the rotation in the OF.
Lindor for two years is better than 1 of Betts. 5 out of 4 people struggle with math.
Well, Jim Bowden is paid to toss out these kind of proposed deals on the radio and in The Athletic, creates interest, but 99 percent certain not to happen. Just don’t see the Dodgers trading Gavin Lux. Great young player. Why would they? Cory Seager figures to fully bounce back and have a great year.
On the other side of Bowden, you have Pedro Moura saying he doesn’t see any of this happening. Why? Because the Dodgers don’t need to do it. They won 106 games, Have great young players, really good young pitchers, a great farm system and a very good major league roster. He predicts the Dodgers re-sign Ryu and add a relief pitcher.
Most MLB analysts think Lindor won’t be traded. Maybe Bryant and probably not Betts. Red Sox are focused on trading one of their pitchers instead. Price would be the one they want to move. Not sure who would want him. Chris Sale? That would be interesting, but is he healthy?
Then there is Ken Rosenthal who thinks Lindor deal is unlikely, but thinks it might work. But would the Dodgers even put it on the table?
Everybody is talking a record setting contract for Gerrit Cole and tossing out all kinds of outlandish numbers. But record setting could mean $217.5 million. I’m guessing higher, but too high a contract could wreck a team if the pitcher gets hurt. Only a few teams, like the Dodgers or Yankees could sustain in that situation.
Bowden talks about windows, but the Dodgers, by design, don’t have a window. Credit Friedman for that. They are built for the short and long haul. Quite brilliant actually.
I have no clue or even a prediction as to what will happen at the winter meetings. I’m guessing they will be more active than Moura thinks, but I wouldn’t be totally surprised if the big signing is to bring back Ryu, creating a rotation with Buehler, Kershaw, Urias, Maeda, May, Stripling and Gonsolin all getting starts during the season.
But then there is this. Last time the Winter Meetings were held in San Diego, who was the most active team? The Dodgers, Friedman’s first year. With money to spend, roster depth and a deep farm system, there is a possibility the Dodgers could be the most active team again.
I think that if the Yankees get Cole, they are a big favorite to win the title next year. There is no way that the Dodgers would be as good, unless we got Strrasburg and Rendon.
Which of these three players is most likely to start next season with a new team: Mookie Betts, Francisco Lindor or Kris Bryant?
GM Survey says: Lindor 8; Bryant 7; Betts 0
Obviously, most would probably have chosen (none of the three) so take this FWIW.
I just think it’s weird how the rules change to accommodate an opinion. I thought the Golden Rules were…
AF will never over pay for a free agent. So, we’re never gonna sign the top guy, so Rendon, Cole and Stras are off the table.
AF will never pay for a reliever. No good relievers left, so we don’t have to waste any time on this one.
AF will never trade a top prospect. Lux just won Minor League Player of the Year.
Mark, you broke two rules in one proposal. Shame on you!
Sign Donaldson and Ryu, trade for Ruiz and Muncy in a package for Betts. No rules broken and Betts provides insurance in case Lux doesn’t work out.
Wiliam wrote: The Dodgers did not have a team reasonably capable of winning the title last year, I don’t care how many regular season games they won. They had only one top starter by season’s end, no fourth starter, which you need in long series. They had no closer and no set-up man. And they didn’t have the great hitter who could drive in key runs with men on base.
I really have to disagree because that is simply not factual.
“One Top Starter by seasons End? Ryu had a bad August but had a 2.13 ERA in September. Buehler was himself in the playoffs, so that’s two top starters. Then Kershaw had a 3.47 ERA in September. and Urias had a 2.25 ERA in September (but they put him in the pen).
What about the Nats? They had a team reasonably capable of winning the World Series? Ha! Ha! Starsburg had a month with an ERA near 6.00 and one at 4.23 but finished strong. Corbin put up a 3.78 ERA in September and Mad Max had a 5.16 ERA in September. Anibal Sanchez had a 4.06 ERA is September and the Nats bullpen was a wreck. Daniel Hudson took over the closers job from Sean Doolittle had a 12.00 ERA in August came back and had a good September and the rest is history.
There is not a sane person on the planet who would have traded the Nats team for the Dodgers, but they executed on the big stage. The Dodgers had an excellent chance of winning, but they did not execute. The Dodgers were superior to the Nats in EVERY way… except on the fild in the playoffs! It was a lack of Execution, not a lack of talent.
… and to say they didn’t have the great hitter who could drive in key runs with men on base is preposterous. Did you ever hear of the NL MVP, not Anthony Rendon, but Cody Bellinger. Bellinger did not execute, but Rendon did.
All true, except….
The Dodgers have been to the playoffs 7 straight years. Seager has been there 3 times as has Bellinger. Tell me when either of these have performed well in the post-season? Kershaw has been inconsistent in the post-season, as has Jansen.
The point isn’t that the Dodgers can’t win the regular season – it’s that they haven’t won the post-season.
“… and to say they didn’t have the great hitter who could drive in key runs with men on base is preposterous. Did you ever hear of the NL MVP, not Anthony Rendon, but Cody Bellinger. Bellinger did not execute, but Rendon did.”
This assumes that Bellinger can or will produce in the post-season – but he never has.
His post-season line in 3 seasons:
.178/.234/.326/.560, 145 PA, 24 H, 52 K.
Seager:
.203/.275/.331/.605, 131 PA, 24 H, 41 K.
Maybe the Dodgers are relying on guys who can’t/won’t perform in the post season. There are guys like that. Wouldn’t it be nice to have some players who can/do?
In 2016 and 2017, Anthony Rendon hit .150 and .176 respectively in the playoffs. If after two years you concluded he could not hit in the playoffs, you would have been wrong as he went off in 2019.
Corey and Cody are young… give them a chance.
If the damn cheating Astros had played it straight, Clayton Kershaw might have been the 2017 World Series Hero, but the dirty bastards cheated!
Agree, keep Kenta and Joc .
Sign:
Cole
Strasburg
Harris
Trade Rios for Giles
Trade Downs Gray Stripling Kelly for Hader
Call it a great off season and see you in spring training.
Rios for Giles – I’m fine with that but doubt the Jays would do it.
Sign Cole AND Strasburg? – we’d be very lucky if Andrew spends for one of those guys let alone two. And keep in mind that both the Yanks and Angels have indicated they’ll spend whatever it takes to get Cole. We might wind up with Strasburg but you can kiss Cole good-bye.
Hader trade – I don’t think the Brewers would take Kelly unless we paid his salary (or most of it). Way too many inconsistent relievers out there for them to take a chance on him at that kind of money. How about Ruiz and Downs and if they agree to it hold your breath that Hader’s arm doesn’t fall off.
Blue Jays need a 1B and DH, that’s got Rios written all over it. The trade simulator says its a fair trade.
We give the Brewers an automatic upgrade to their starting pitching in Stripling, a potential starting pitcher in Gray, a position player that can play any of SS 2B CF positions, not to mention our soon to be #2 and #3 prospects and make them eat Kelly’s contract. The trade simulator says its a fair trade.
I don’t want the Dodgers to trade Ruiz because I want a backup catcher that can produce offensively as good as the primary catcher. If the Dodgers acquire that kind of backup catcher, then I’m more than willing to trade Ruiz.
Signing Cole and Strasburg is wishful thinking, I’d still try to sign them, but if the Dodgers can’t sign both, then I would add Tyler Clippard to my free agent wish list.
It’s going to take Rios and someone like Carrillo to get Giles and Carrillo could be better than Giles. Giles has never performed on the big stage.
It’s one thing to excel on a bad team with nothing at stake… even in Miami or TB or Toronto, but how do you do in front of 50,000+ fans in Dodger Stadium?
And the Brewers will not want “pieces” for Hader. They want “centerpieces.”