Well I got my hopes up earlier in the week when Rob Manfred met face to face with Tony Clark and “reached a framework that could form the basis of an agreement” for a 2020 restart with full prorated play. On June 17, the twitter world was all abuzz about this pending “deal”.
Jon Heyman
Breaking: MLB and players union are closing in on an agreement to play the 2020 season, via players. Deal expected to be for prorated pay and include expanded playoffs.
As part of the pending agreement to play the 2020 season between MLB and the players union, the union has agreed to waive any grievance.
Evan Drellich
Major League Baseball sent a new proposal for the 2020 season to the Major League Baseball Players Association a short while ago, sources say.
Source says no deal is close yet between MLB and MLBPA because the proposal was just sent by MLB. No agreement even in principle at this point.
Buster Olney
Sources: The owners’ latest offer to the PA is for 60 games, full pro-rata, starting July 19.
Bob Nightengale
The MLB playoffs would expand from 10 teams to 16 teams under the new proposal.
Jon Heyman again
Owners also agree to $25M player playoff pool plus $33M in salary forgiveness for players already fronted part of $170M advance so min. $ guys wouldn’t return for no $. So in effect players get >100% prorated. In any case some players view latest as only proposal, not agreement
Joel Sherman wrote an article where he offered that MLB would like to sell advertisements on team uniforms this season and next to accrue additional revenue. Just great, NASCAR comes to MLB.
Hold Your Horses – Tony Clark later offered the following statement:
“In my discussions with Rob in Arizona we explored a potential pro rata framework, but I made clear repeatedly in that meeting and after it that there were a number of significant issues with what he proposed, in particular the number of games. It is unequivocally false to suggest that any tentative agreement or other agreement was reached in that meeting.”
MLBPA never conceded that there was an agreement, only the framework of a proposal. MLBPA countered the 60 game proposal with a 70 game proposal, and the owners apparently got a little miffed at a counter proposal. As far as they were concerned, Manfred was supposed to get MLBPA to accept a 60 game proposal.
Clark later clarified the dust up with MLBPA’s counterproposal by indicating that it wasn’t just MLBPA’s opinion that they MLB was expecting a counterproposal:
“In fact, in conversations within the last 24 hours, Rob invited a counterproposal for more games that he would take back to the owners. We submitted that counterproposal today.”
Apparently Manfred acknowledged that their plan was simply a proposal and that he in fact did invite MLBPA to present a counterproposal. Although he did indicate that if the proposal was for 70 games, it would be “an impossible figure to fit in without extending play”.
Manfred has since clarified indicating that MLB will not consider any schedule over 60 games, and have rejected the counterproposal. He says there will be no additional counterproposal. Of course he has said that before.
On June 18, Manfred said that “This needs to be over”. Was he referring to the negotiations, the spat being played out in the media, or some other form of reference? Per Manfred…
“I don’t know what Tony and I were doing there for several hours going back and forth and making trades if we weren’t reaching an agreement.”
June 19th brought another wrinkle to the potential rising of the phoenix. Five Phillies players and three staff members have tested positive for Coronavirus from their Clearwater, FL facility. Toronto also shut down their Dunedin, FL because one of their players on the 40 man displayed symptoms (no positive test) after spending time with players in the Phillies system. Dunedin and Clearwater are next door to each other (4.1 miles apart).
The Giants have also closed their Scottsdale ST facilities due to coronavirus concerns. Apparently one person at the facility and one family member have displayed mild symptoms and were tested. The test results are not yet known.
As a result of three facilities being shut down, MLB is now considering closing all 30 facilities. Per Joel Sherman:
Source: with 3 camps having to close today due to COVID-19, MLB is strongly considering closing all 30 camps again to cleanse and re-establish a system in which players will test regularly when they return. Right now there is not a firm protocol for players using the facilities.
Done: Per Bob Nightengale, as of right now, all 30 teams have their facilities shut down. No player or staff will be permitted in the facility unless they have tested negative to the coronavirus.
As a minimum, I am now of the opinion,
- MLB and MLBPA should quit the fighting through the media and refocus their efforts and try to establish a real framework for the next CBA, behind the scenes…out of the public’s eye. Manfred and Clark should exit, and adults only should be invited to the discussions. No leaks, no press.
- Manfred should be fired by the owners as soon as the season is cancelled. He has proven to be as incompetent of a Commissioner as MLB has ever experienced. He makes Bud Selig look skilled and knowledgeable. He has botched everything from trivial game changes to save 2 minutes a game; to the Astros cheating scandal; Red Sox cheating scandal; and now the alleged cover up of the New York Yankees cheating. And of course the current restart negotiations for 2020 have been an unmitigated disaster. He is a mere puppet looking for a way to salvage his legacy. Rob, it’s too late to salvage anything.
- Player agents should be told to butt out of the negotiations. They can negotiate on their clients’ behalf, but the union will be negotiating for the Player Association, of which player agents are not a member. Scott Boras does not care for any player that is not his client. And why should he? But then he does not deserve a seat at the table for negotiations on behalf of 1,200 players (30 teams 40 man roster). And baseball journalists who actually care about the health of the sport should cease asking Scott his opinion of the ongoing negotiations.
- MLB and MLBPA should be reminded that it is the fans who pay, either through the gate, merchandise, food concessions, parking, and of course through advertising. TV and radio deals are a little more tricky because they have fixed contracts, but if viewership drops, so will future TV revenues. Likewise with radio network advertising. It is not as important for 2020 as it should be for the foundation of the new CBA. Somebody needs to represent the fans, and that should be the commissioner who is responsible for “the good of the game”. And that is not Pinocchio (Rob Manfred).
- The season should be cancelled, and the ST facilities should be thoroughly cleaned. Current MiLB players and signed draft picks and undrafted free agents should report to Arizona and focus on their development. The organizations should concentrate on their testing and re-testing protocols. Let the MiLB players play amongst the other teams in the area. My guess is that there will be sufficient interest to house and play a number of MiLB players who do not fear the virus. For those players and staff who do not want to take the chance, they should be allowed to opt out without any negative consequences.
- I would allow teams to begin to negotiate with their own players, beginning from season cancellation date to September 1. After September 1, teams can continue to negotiate with their team controlled player personnel, but free agents can begin to negotiate with other teams.
I personally have zero desire to see the implementation of a 50 game season. That is not an MLB season, but more of a glorified seeding for a 16-team playoffs. That really does not interest me. I love baseball, and I will be back just as strong and excited in 2021. I will miss the game, but I will find other things to do. The implementation of a 50 game season is nothing more than an ego massage for Rob Manfred.
If the two sides had worked diligently from the March Agreement, decisions (compromises) could have been made by adult negotiators who thought more about the long-term effect of the game, instead of their own selfish desires.
The leadership of the game has failed with this unprecedented situation. Could they (should they) have done something different? In the end, I doubt it. But the plug should have been pulled long ago without the consistent and perpetual infighting. It’s akin to pulling of a band-aid. Pull it of fast and the sting goes away quicker, or pull it off slowly and the pain will persist. Most fans would have been initially upset, but we would have accepted it. Now we fans have been soured mostly because of the immature negotiations between billionaires and millionaires.
MLB is different than the NBA and the NHL. Those seasons were winding down and just needed to put a bow on them with the playoffs. And yet there remains a lot of concerns with Orlando and the NBA. Now one of the NHL teams (Tampa Bay Lightning) had to shut down their training facilities due to multiple players (3) and staff members (2) testing positive for COVID-19. MLB has not yet started, and IMO should not at this point. It will sting, and it may take a few years (like the last time), but the fans will return.
It’s time to change the players, and I am not speaking of those guys on the field.
Excellent post Jeff. I agree with all your major points.
I think the season should be officially cancelled and they should sit down and start negotiating the next CBA in the hopes that it can go into effect a year early, starting with the 2021 season.
Both Manfred and Clark should be shown the door before those negotiations begin. Have skilled negotiators from each side at the table, people who have previously been a part of major negotiations and know how to compromise.
MLB 2020 is like the horse you love that has broken its leg. You know you’re going to have to shoot it but you can’t get yourself to pull the trigger.
A bunch you you all went thru nostalgic OC/LA beaches and restaurants yesterday.
Well, guess what my dinner was last night? Pioneer Chicken! Yes, there’s actually 2 of them left in LA. I’m quite sure I’ve not eaten there since 1990 or late 80’s.
Yes! I spent lots of time at Pioneer in the good ol’ days.
Well articulated Jeff. Thanks for being a voice of reason.
Totally agree, and the idea that the CBA should be negotiated now and implemented in 2021 is a great idea. Clark and Manfred are inept and should be replaced. But, we all know Manfred is the owners perfect mouth piece so he is going no where. As for this season, there is no hope for what anyone would call a real compromise. To me anything less than 100 games is just a motion of futility. Baseball is made for the long haul. And personally, I am tired of the whole dance. There are other things I can occupy my time with.
If these new Yankee accusations of cheating are true and they are from 2017 I would change and be in favor of awarding that title to the Dodgers. Previously I thought the Yankees had a case as well. I hope they play this year but I would maybe put more value on a 2017 championship than a 60 game 2020 championship which would have it own asterisk.
I do not want the 2017 Championship that way and neither do the Dodgers. All of the players queried when all of that crap started said the same thing. They wanted to win it on the field. Awarding the title to LA would be an empty gesture. Now, vacating the title, and removing it from the Astro’s, that I would be all for. No winner that year. They do not get to keep their rings, and the trophy goes back to the commissioners office. They should not reap any rewards for cheating. Same reason I do not think any of the juicers belong in the hall.
I’m in agreement with everyone here.
Very coherent point of view Jeff. I’ve thought this is where we were headed for a long time but I could not have articulated as well as you just did.
Very disappointing news. Agree with your points, AC. I wonder if we can impeach Manfred and Tony Clark. On a more positive note, I want to wish all you fathers on this site a Happy Father’s Day. Enjoy it.
What are the new Yankees accusations? Where did you read them?
First reported by MLBrumors I think. Then twitter and ESPN
Here are a few articles. Many are seeing the sealing of the letter as a cover up.
https://www.si.com/mlb/yankees/news/sign-stealing-scandal-judge-orders-letter-from-mlb-to-yankees-unsealed#:~:text=A%20New%20York%20judge%20ruled,stealing%20scheme%2C%20must%20be%20unsealed.
https://nypost.com/2020/06/17/judge-isnt-buying-yankees-excuse-to-keep-mlb-letter-private/
https://www.masslive.com/redsox/2020/06/yankees-sign-stealing-federal-judge-suspends-unsealing-of-letter-from-rob-manfred-to-brian-cashman.html
Well written and thought out AC! With the new COVID “circumstances” being reported in the training camps, I believe that might be the nail in the coffin for this season. It certainly gives, for better or worse, the owners the opportunity to “save face” if the season is now cancelled.
A few have us have continued to ask – “what happens when players test positive?” without anyone being able to answer. The answer was obvious. THIS is what happens. Facilities close.
Last one out of the building please turn off the lights and don’t forget to lock up.
Soccer, which is now up and running again here in the Uk had exactly the same problems about a month back, when the players first reported back for training.
All the players were tested, and a number were found to be infected although they were showing no symptoms.
They had to Self Isolate for a week before being tested again. They could only train in small groups to begin with, before the size of the groups increased until everyone was involved.
It seems the US is about 3 weeks behind us in this battle. Don’t give up yet as I remember thinking that those early positive tests would be the final nail – that wasn’t the case. We are up and running, and although certainly not perfect, I’m really enjoying watching LIVE sport.
These are teething problems. Hopefully MLB will persevere – Baseball will be a welcome distraction.
You will be amazed how different things will seem in 2/3 weeks if you guys follow the same path as the Uk.
At last we got to see a Mookie Betts hit a walk off….Never mind.
Got to laugh. MLB wants 60 games, the players 70. And they can’t reach agreement. Shows the farce this has become.
Terrific post Jeff. Very informative and well thought out. Manfred and Clark are a joke but both sides are equally guilty and the big loser will be baseball (the fans). I see no chance for a 2020 season for a number of reasons.
Why bother training and gearing up for 50 games and then a phony playoff? 50 games is a joke. The squabbles over money fall on deaf ears with Joe and Jane Public.
My second concern is the health of the players which gets lost with negotiations taking center stage. I mentioned previously that the number of cases and potential for getting the virus will make players stay away and facilities unable to host players. And my information about the severity of the virus in Arizona was met here with doubt and scorn by some for being “political”, fake, inaccurate or manipulated. (The Moon Landing was faked, Elvis and Hitler lived together in Argentina) So, if you share that idea on the virus, save your breath in responding to me or just move on.
But here are the “facts” as I see them in Arizona from the US Coronavirus site:
On June 1 there were 20,00 cases reported and 917 deaths.
On June 20, there are 49,796 cases and 1338 deaths
That looks like a spike to me.
So, maybe the numbers are not 100% accurate but I don’t know how anyone can deny that there is a big problem.
With the recent cases showing up in Florida and these numbers in Arizona there is absolutely no way the players, minor leaguers included, should or would report to these training sites.
The Arizona Governor is already taking heat for the spike in cases from some who feeling he reopened up restaurants and bars too early and relaxed restrictions. It would be interesting to see if he would agree to opening team facilities.
With 50 game proposal, is the risk-reward worth it? Not to me.
I like the suggestion that it’s time to pull the plug on 2020 and start negotiations without Clark and Manfred, on a new agreement for 2021. Even then I’m not sure irreparable damage hasn’t been done to MLB. But I remember making that boycott threat in 94.
I suggested many years ago that there needed to be a “National Fan Association” to give the fanbase a seat at the negotiations table. My thought, half in jest, was I’d be a great representative. While I’m lobbying for that job anymore, it might be time for the ultimate victims to have a say. Right now, I’m ready to vote with my feet.
Because I submitted this so late last night you may not have seen it yesterday. I see it as a glimmer of hope for how COVID-19 may impact the players themselves.
These articles on the COVID-19 outbreak experienced by sailors in close quarters on the USS Theodore Roosevelt could be relevant to most baseball players. Only 2 people had symptoms serious enough to require hospitalization.
“This study shows young, healthy adults with COVID-19 might have mild, atypical, or no symptoms; therefore, symptom-based surveillance might not detect all infections,” the Navy statement says. “Use of face coverings and other preventive measures could mitigate transmission in similar settings.”
https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/military/story/2020-06-09/cdc-study-of-roosevelt-outbreak-finds-lower-rates-of-covid-19-among-sailors-who-wore-masks
https://www.wtkr.com/news/military/navy-cdc-release-findings-from-covid-19-investigation-on-uss-theodore-roosevelt
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6923e4.htm?s_cid=mm6923e4_w
The way this has played out it had to happen that two of the states that opened wide and quickly would host “spring training”.
Thank you Watford for the encouraging comparison.
I do not think any of us are privy to what the owners are telling Manfred, but we do have a better idea of what the players are telling Tony Clark. I have heard that there are 6-8 teams who absolutely do not want to play in 2020 because they will lose more money by playing than not playing. Maybe other teams could subsidize them, but I don’t see that happening. I am ambivalent about Rob Manfred because I do not know what the owners are telling him.
I am biased to a degree because as a business owner, I have sacrificed and paid employees when I could not pay myself. I have been evicted, had a car re-possessed, had utilities shut-off, IRS sweeps of my bank account, and through it all, my employees were always paid… and paid well.
All of that is in the rear-view mirror. I have a booming business and life is good. I have a large number of people who have been with me for 10-15 years. We pay them well, they get holiday pay and paid personal leave, profit-sharing, 401(k), health insurance and a great place to work, but I am not going to share profits with them (beyond our ordinary plan). I took all the risk – they had none. Does that make me greedy?
For many years, I worked 70-80 -90 hours a week and it was my ass on the line and my signature on the loans. My wife and I are entrepreneurs by nature and choice. We risked it all, so now 20 years later, we are reaping the benefits. My son told me yesterday “Dad, I guess when I was a kid, that we were poor. I never felt poor – I thought we were rich.” I said that we were never poor – we were always rich, but just did not have any money. Money does not make you rich and lack of it does not make you poor.
There are not many teams who make a lot of money right now, but the value of the team and a subsequent sale is were they can make a lot of money (i.e, Frank McCourt). The Wilpons are trying to sell, but it is a limited market. Not many people can pull that off. Christopher Ilitch now owns the Tigers, but his dad tried and tried to buy a championship before he died and could not do it. The A’s, Giants, Angels, Orioles, TB, and Pittsburgh are all likely for sale. Good luck with that.
I think a day of reckoning is coming in baseball. The long, guaranteed contracts have driven up prices immensely. It is very difficult to go to a game and not spend $150 or more a person. Maybe that’ works in football (where there is a salary cap and 16 games) or in basketball (where there is a cap on what players can make and 82 games with only 12 players) but in baseball, with 162 games and guaranteed contracts, it’s generally not a business where the average team turns a huge profit. I think this pandemic has devalued every franchise and some may not weather the storm.
The Oakland A’s may be worth a Billion (I doubt it), but good luck in finding a buyer right about now. MLB teams are having difficulty right about now. Some owners are bleeding the team – I get that, but it’s their business… and it is a business. Fortunately, the Dodgers are well-run… the Angels? Not so much!
The owners are not going to budge off of 60 games and Dr. Fauci has said the season should be over by September, so they can point to that… even if we all know it’s because of the large monetary losses each game, for some teams.
I think there will be a lockout and maybe no baseball in 2021… or at least a very shortened season. I think the players should take the 60 games and get ready to play this year. MLB will give them 60 games and the playoffs. Next year, the owners will try and restore some sanity to the process and there will have to be more revenue sharing, min/max salary caps, and maybe even some changes in guaranteed contracts. The negotiations this year will look like a lovefest compared to next year.
COVID-19 is something that players are going to get and professional leagues are ready and able to manage it. It’s very difficult to interpret the data right now, especially case fatality rate (CFR). While it is true that cases are spiking in some areas, death rates are dropping, even though testing is increasing dramatically. It may be a year or more before we have reasonably good data on the CFR. When there are financial incentives attached to listing the cause of death as “COVID-19” the statistics are not totally reliable.
I still think they will play. If they don’t this might kill baseball – we won’t have to wait another year for it to happen.
A wealthy person buys a franchise, mismanages it, disappoints fan base, drafts players who can’t play for another team for years, then sells it at a big profit and players don’t benefit from the franchise’s appreciation. That is not the story you told of your business Mark. Not a one size fits all situation.
Well said MT. In a very over simplified outlook I completely agree. Players have to keep themselves in shape and play the game……….that’s all (I know way over simplified). Owners have to market, scout, support player development, pay front office staff, security, concessioners, insurance, workers compensation, health benefits etc.
Mark agre with most of what you said but your comments about financial incentives to declare deaths being due to Covid-19are off base.
Total cases in the US, 2329593,
Total deaths in the US, 121,960
Percent deaths, 5.2%
Total cases worldwide (minus US) , 6,575,782
Total deaths (minus US), 344,270
Percent deaths, 5.2%
If the US is fudging numbers in order to get Medicare reimbursements, then I guess every country from Afghanistan to Zimbabwe are also fudging numbers to get Medicare reimbursement.
Two things:
1. When it is all over with I think you will find that vastly more people have had the virus, bringing down the death rate dramatically.
2. I like this from Bloomberg:
Assessing the risks posed by Covid-19 has become a morbid global pastime. So has weighing them against the risks posed by other things like seasonal influenza or car accidents or drowning in the pool. A key element in many of these comparisons is the age distribution of the risk. The coronavirus mostly kills people with a limited number of years ahead of them, some have reasoned, so its potential death toll should be discounted relative to that of an ailment or other risk that has a greater effect on the young.
This is not incorrect. But it’s also not a reason to dismiss the threat the disease poses. “When you get old, something kills you,” economist and demographer Lyman Stone wrote on Twitter after sharing some charts that inspired the one above. “But Covid is an extra something. An extra wolf in the pack.”
Seasonal influenza, to which Covid-19 is often compared, is also a disease that preys mostly on the elderly, with the age distribution of its victims often tilted even more toward the very old than that of the coronavirus so far. In 2018, 83% of influenza and pneumonia deaths in the U.S. were among those 65 and older, and two-thirds among those 75 and older. Many influenza-related deaths are attributed to pneumonia on the death certificates from which the CDC’s detailed age-group numbers are derived.
The new strains of influenza that cause pandemics don’t always work this way. Only 13% of the estimated 12,469 U.S. deaths in the 2009-2010 H1N1 pandemic were among those 65 and older, and the elderly’s apparent resistance to that virus was one reason the fatality rate was so low. The earlier H1N1 strain that caused the pandemic of 1918 and 1919 was much more virulent, causing an estimated 675,000 deaths among a U.S. population less than a third the size of today’s, and was especially hard on those in their 20s through 40s.
It’s an interesting read: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2020-05-07/comparing-coronavirus-deaths-by-age-with-flu-driving-fatalities
A 5.2% death rate is very likely high. Remember, early on, the rate being discussed was 1.0%. The higher death rate being shown right now indicates that we have more cases of Covid-19 then is being reported ( I suspect a factor of 10). However, the under reporting of cases is something that should be fairly consistent world wide (except for places like Iceland and such where very detailed tracking has been done). So the fact the death rate mirrors the rest of the world is something I would expect. Experts also are on record as saying the death rate being reported is lower than what is really is.
Season flu is not being compared to Covid-19. Only places like Fox News seem to want to state that. You previously stated that the Hong Kong flu lead to 100,000 deaths and we didn’t shut down the country so why are we doing it now. You can’t compare the two. In this instance, you have a population where no preventative measures were put in place.
With Covid-19 we have over 100,000 dead with a population that has sheltered in place, worn face masks and has made hand washing more routine. So the two situations are statistically different. By putting restrictions in place we have been able to slow the spread so hospitals are not overwhelmed and possible therapeutics can be developed (some talk the other day about a steroid treatment possibly reducing the risk of dying). Without sheltering in place, deaths world wide would be significantly higher then they are.
Does Covid-19 affect the old more, yes it does. The other day I posted this link
https://miro.medium.com/max/2000/1*RKopICIN0FVeBwOWWlkwhQ.png
I don’t know about you but to me a death is a death whether one is in their 20’s or 80’s. So while my in laws might have lead full lives, I rather they not succumb to the virus and die because hey we need to help Wall Street make new highs.
Going to be offline for a couple of days. With all this idiocy going on around this country, I am heading to the hills. Gonna fish, catch some zzzzzz’s and just relax. Nut jobs in Cali pulled down and defaced a statue of U.S. Grant. A General who defeated Lee’s army and battled the KKK during his presidency. No sense of history or knowledge of it either. Pure lunacy.
I’m not much of a fisherman so help me here–what kind of a fish is a zzzzzzzzz?
All true what you said bear unless it was Native Americans that knocked down the statue.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ’s as in sleep……or a zebra fish,. but you only find those in fish tanks……doubt it was native Americans. They have more respect for history.
Well, they say, “It ain’t over till it’s over!” The next week or two will tell whether there is a season or not, and we aren’t privy to what’s going on behind the scenes. From where I sit, it sure looks like a bunch of selfish, incompetent people doing the negotiating. But if they will reach an agreement is anyone’s guess. We’ll know soon enough. Either way, we’ll all survive, even if there is no baseball this year. If there is one thing this corona situation has shown me, it’s to be grateful for what you have. If you are healthy, have people you care about and vice versa, and can keep a roof over your head, you are among the lucky ones on this earth. Many people don’t have these things, especially now.
One final thing on the effect of social distancing and quarantining the elderly in hospitals or nursing homes. What effect does that have on the death rate? Humans are much more than statistics and being isolated from loved ones when ill can cause some people to just give up. Human interaction is important to recovery from any disease, physical or mental. I believe that loneliness and isolation have played a big part in the death rate.
Also, to put the death rate at 5.2% is silly. Many health experts think the infection rate is at least 10X what is known. I believe when it is all said and done, it will be under 0.5%!
Absotutely MT. I visited my 92 year old mother-in-law in a care facility yesterday. We could only talk to her thru a fence and any touching was verboten. To see the look on her face as she was told that she could not touch anyone, just about dropped her on the spot, seriously. I think the wildly inconsistent rules and social practices imposed on us all, really cause many, if not most, to realize a lot of this stuff has nothing to do with science or “the follow the data” declarations. Manipulation at any level on any subject is just plain wrong and cruel to society as a whole. I fear we are all being manipulated and our reasoning powers have been tossed in favor of emotional responses to each and every issue that we are facing currently.
If you read my posts you would see I agree, 5.2% is to high and I say by a factor of 10. But I stated these numbers to show the US and world death rates are the same (and a sad indictment of the US handling of this virus). If this is the case then the statements being made about Medicare fraud are incorrect. Not to mention any doctor who would purposely put people under ventilators would be going against their Hippocratic oath.
Do we have inconsistent rules for dealing with Covid-19. Yes. But what do you think happens when our current administration punts on having national guidelines and leaves everything to the states. There is a reason why the US has 4% of the world population and 25% of the world’s deaths.
In March Harvard epidemiologist Marc Lipsitch said 40-70% of Americans would be infected with this virus. I quoted him here and got little response. I said then I thought he was right and I still think he’s right. OBVIOUSLY most will recover, but all who get this thing will be scarred.
I’m reading article after article that points out a certain faction of this country is telling us to not believe the scientists and that the media is our enemy. I’m stuck here wondering how the hell does one reason with the unreasonable? I have not found that way yet. I don’t know who first said it but know this to be true – suffering is to resist what is.
I have stuff to to do so I’ll leave you this morning with this:
“To acquire knowledge, one must study;
but to acquire wisdom, one must observe.”
― Marilyn vos Savant
Carson Taylor (our 4th rounder) signs for $400k. Slot value was $434k so we have a little more to add to the Vogel-Beeter fund.
HAPPY FATHER’S DAY UPDATE IMAGE ABOVE
Yes, Happy Fathers Day to you all on this board
“…all who get this thing will be scarred.”
That’s a new one, ALL will be scarred, you mean emotionally, physically? I think you have to consider the source when quoting such absolutes.
“Knowledge, science and life experience must all be considered when managing a problem, emotions aren’t reality, emotions typically confuse and deceive” –Truth vos Hurts
Covid-19 can have post hospital problems (kidneys, lung, heart). I also wonder what all of this will do to children ( lack of play dates, schooling,Increased obsession compulsion).
Not everyone will be scarred but some percentage of the population will.
Consider the source. Excellent advice.
You’re right, not ALL will be left with damaged psyches and scarred lungs. According to Johns Hopkins, the milder cases won’t likely leave lasting issues. “After a serious case of COVID-19, a patient’s lungs can recover, but not overnight. “Recovery from lung damage takes time,” Galiatsatos says. “There’s the initial injury to the lungs, followed by scarring. Over time, the tissue heals, but it can take three months to a year or more for a person’s lung function to return to pre-COVID-19 levels.”
(cytokine storm – google it)
He notes that doctors and patients alike should be prepared for continuing treatment and therapy.
“Once the pandemic is over, there will be a group of patients with new health needs: the survivors. Doctors, respiratory therapists and other health care providers will need to help these patients recover their lung function as much as possible.”
Thanks for pointing out my overstatement.
But let’s not underestimate the seriousness of this disease. As one writer who had it and recovered put it – “it’s like the flu with fangs”.
MLBPA has decided to hold their vote on the 60 game schedule today after all. There will be 38 votes; 8 from the executive committee and one representative for each team. The executive committee is expected to unanimously reject the proposal. The executive committee (led by Max Scherzer) seems very hostile to the entire negotiations. And the vibe is that the players as a group will reject it.
If they reject it, I hope they make a counter proposal that owners can swallow. Find something they will give for an additional 10 games other than salary.
Baseball is not being played because Covid 19 is highly contagious and dangerous. Covid 19 is a pandemic because it hasn’t been mitigated early and consistently. Give it free reign and many will suffer and more will die. Hospitals were overrun and caretakers were overworked and while almost getting back to normal, it is happening again where states have overly relaxed mitigation. Whether 60,000 or 120,000 people have died from Covid 19, let’s agree that number could have been reduced and the future doesn’t have to repeat it.
I am very comfortable shopping at Costco because everybody wears a mask.
MLBPA can suck eggs.
I agree with what Bum just said. We would have baseball being played if not for the virus. And if some would have had their way the stadiums would have been filled with people, none wearing masks. And think where we would be if that had happened.
I read Orange County just endured its deadliest week. The numbers are going back up. Even in some Indiana counties. (Regenstreif Institute, not me Hurts)
Joel Sherman has an article out which basically says there are front office people, agents and players who aren’t on board with obstinance being shown by both sides in the negotiations. Problem is that their voices are being overcome by the others. Basically he’s saying that neither side is as united as they both would like to have everyone think they are.
There are some people in the game who realize that coming together here is far more important to the future of the game than winning this one battle and taking no prisoners.
https://nypost.com/2020/06/21/mlbs-best-hope-is-for-the-silent-majority-to-rise-up-sherman/
let’s hope that faction steps up (in baseball, and in life)
I believe there is a silent majority, in all aspects of our society. People in the middle are afraid to speak up for fear of being chastised. We are being manipulated by extremes. So why should it be any different in MLB.
The MLBPA Executive subcommittee members are:
Andrew Miller
Daniel Murphy
Max Scherzer
Elvis Andrus
Cory Gearrin
Chris Iannetta
James Paxton
Collin McHugh
They appear to be united in their position to reject the offer. How will the players vote with it not being a secret ballot? If players vote to accept, will they be ostracized? Why are the owners being “bullied” by 6-8 owners? It is time to get rid of owners who do not value the game (institution) of MLB as much as their investment. I am a capitalist and believe wholeheartedly in a free market system. That being said, no team should accept consistent losses, but there is no evidence that any team is. Owners can start by putting a competitive team on the field. That means you Bob Nutting (Pirates) and Peter Angelos (Orioles). They can start by denying these franchises any revenue sharing. If they do not want to compete there will be no additions to their bank accounts. Force them out “for the good of the game”. They can follow that up by pulling the plug on MLB teams in Florida. It has not worked yet. Pull Oakland out of the Bay Area. The Bay Area cannot support two teams, and Oakland has a horrible complex. I also have no problem with contraction.
Tell the players, if you do not want a cap, that is okay with the owners. But you and your agents do not get to dictate what fair market value is for the industry. You are more than welcome to determine what fair market value is for your particular situation, but not for MLB as a whole. MLBPA you do not get to draw a correlation between revenues and salaries if you are not willing to tie your salaries to revenues. Players choose not to because in their eyes that is a salary cap. If your negotiators are not responsible enough (or competent) for getting an understanding up front what happens if there are no fans, do not blame the owners. It is Tony Clark, Bruce Meyer, and the MLBPA Executive Subcommittee who are to blame. That group let the owners dictate what happens if there is no agreement going forward.
The silent majority is correct. Both leaderships have let the industry down. Both should be blamed, and both leadership groups should be stripped of their negotiation privileges. Do this now before negotiations for the next CBA commences.
Some good stuff Jeff. Are you willing to take over for Manfred?
I’ll take over for Clark.
We should be able to get this taken care of in about 15 minutes.
Well stated Jeff.
I just get the feeling that it didn’t matter what # of games the owners countered with, it was going to be rejected.
Just stopping in to say hello to all you fellow walking antiques. Hello to all others who may fit in any other category. I’ve tried several times to put in a reply but didn’t click ‘post comment’ because I’m not viewing things with a lot of optimism. The future ain’t what it used to be, as if it ever was, but it wasn’t so Soylent Green. In that movie Edward G. Robinson stated he was born in 1954 which put the time frame fairly close. But the parallels end there…..well? This could really be only the start for this pandemic and baseball might be at an end with it’s biggest fan base born near 1954 all dying off. I’ve always been told “you have an overactive imagination” so sorry for the gloom but it’s June so Hello all and play-ball!
Welcome back, Quas!
No vote today but the owners are amending their offer and the vote will take place later this week. They want to reach a deal.
They have to!
I agree. If they could get the games going there would be zero competition from other sports. The tv ratings would be huge and lots of kids sitting at home would become life long fans. Big opportunity!
I may be cynical, but the elimination of both the universal DH and the expanded playoff format in 2021 is not a decision changer. MLBPA has gone from a vote in Sunday, to a vote later in the week, back to a vote on Sunday, and back to later in the week. Maybe as Joel Sherman indicated, the more reasonable players are making an impact. The veterans continue to say that they are fighting for the next group coming up. I am thinking that next group coming up is saying…”great for you Gerrit Cole, but maybe if you took $250MM instead of $324MM, those of us who are fighting for $1MM to $2MM could double our salaries. Most of us will never make that kind of money, or anywhere in the neighborhood.”
I want baseball back. I don’t care if it’s a 10 game season, followed by a 30 team playoff schedule. A ring is a ring, and we’re good enough to win it all in 162, 100, or 10 game seasons.
Health is a different matter. But if the health aspects are figured out, then “play ball!!”
Happy Father’s Day to all you dads out there. Just spent a wonderful day with my nearly 21 year old daughter, whom I haven’t seen in 6 months. She was stuck in the US waiting out the pandemic, and just flew back to Holland to spend the summer here. Makes you appreciate them even more when you can’t see them. She insisted on observing social distance until she gets her Covid test result back. Didn’t want to infect us. Couldn’t be more proud of her!
i think that if all states had shut down effectively as Washington, New York, and Michigan have, we would be in pretty good shape. But very few did, and some of those opened up too soon. This is an opinion simply based on data we are seeing. Most us live in Los Angeles, and i am appalled at what I see; so many people not wearing masks, talking to people a foot away, now sitting together in restaurants and acting as there was no risk at all. How can they be so foolish and selfish? They will never control this unless and until there is a very effective vaccine, and then it has to be distributed. Maybe his will happen by next year, but if it does not, we will be no better off than now.
Back to baseball, I would also like to see it played. But there are so many roadblocks to not only starting, but actually continuing to finish whatever short season they agree on. I concur with Jeff D. in that I have no real interest in seeing 50 games with reconstituted divisions, and then an expanded playoff. This is even worse than what the NBA has done for decades. They might as well just skip the baseball regular season and go right to the playoffs. And what will winning a title mean? Not very much. An 80-game season and a regular playoffs might have been okay; after all, this has happened a couple of times. But this has gone on too long now. If they are worried about health, as they should be, then just cancel the season ,and somehow try to work out an agreement for next year. If they play this gimmick season now, and then have a lockout next year, many fans will stop following the sport, it wouldn’t be worth it. I know it is a cliche, but the owners and players in all sports are so in love with their own money and fame that they really do nothing more than pay lip service to the fans, without whom there would be no pro sports at all. Fans are not a bunch of suckers who fantasize about being sports stars or billionaires, and just want to bask in their reflected glory. The fans have always come back, but it is not a guarantee, not at previous levels of commitment.